Amazing...

[choda]

”The player that impressed me most was Zokora,” Ramos told Marca when questioned on his favourite player at Spurs!

And apparently he wants to buy him in January for 8 million. Call me old fashioned but I nearly fell off my chair when I heard that.

And that would also have to place major question marks over Juande's tactical and transfer prowess to add to his language difficulties if it is true.

That would be an awesome deal for us and then we can go after some far better central midfielders and free up some extra cash.

I think we also need to put this in the context of the abuse Commolli got as well for not buying central midfielders. Juande thinks Zokora is great so Commoli wasn't being told to rectify the initial error. No, wonder we didn't sign players for that position.

[gomessi]

marca are almost as bad as the sun choda:001_rolleyes:

marca is like the mothpiece of madrid but they also come out with a lot of shit.

I thin k earlier this year they had a story saying real were willing to pay £100m for ronaldo and hand him £300k per week.

I will hold my hands up if he does sign zokora but I dont think he is even interested.

IF we did get any kind of decent offer then we should sell him but I doubt anyone will pay near £8m for him

[gomessi]

The player that impressed me most was Zokora

that quote alone should discredit the story mate. do you really think he was more impressed by zok or by berbatov and keane.

[choda]

Yea, it did seem crazy.

Sometimes when you see direct quotes though you even believe the scummer rags.

The media is just getting worse.

[gomessi]

Yea, it did seem crazy.

Sometimes when you see direct quotes though you even believe the scummer rags.

The media is just getting worse.

not even zokoras family could say he was the most impressive player at spurs.

I reckon ramos was definatly trying to replace but with jj as holding midfielder (yes I know that is just as bad).

I reckon ramos was going for this team

pav arshavin

gio jj mod bentley

I guess he was trying to copy arsenal who play with similar sort of players

[peterc]

According to this report Ramos highly rates Zokora. Surprise, surprise..

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_4623835,00.html

This report goes even further stating that Real will make a bid for him in the January window.

[MiloMinderbinder]

According to this report Ramos highly rates Zokora. Surprise, surprise..

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_4623835,00.html

This report goes even further stating that Real will make a bid for him in the Janury window.

According to people that watch him week in week out and know what they are watching and talking about, and aren't scumbag journos untermensch, Zokora is shite, pure utter, unadultarated shite.

[peterc]

According to people that watch him week in week out and know what they are watching and talking about, and aren't scumbag journos untermensch, Zokora is shite, pure utter, unadultarated shite.

Obviously, you haven't watched us play recently, because Zokora has played extremely well in our last two gsmes.:001_rolleyes:

[JuicE]

Obviously, you haven't watched us play recently, because Zokora has played extremely well in our last two gsmes.:001_rolleyes:

'Extremely better" perhaps but not well! Lets get the right perspective here shall we? He ain't going to Real Madrid unless they got shit in their eyes!

[peterc]

'Extremely better" perhaps but not well! Lets get the right perspective here shall we? He ain't going to Real Madrid unless they got shit in their eyes!

It all depends in what position he plays. He has proven to be quite effective in his recent position.

[MiloMinderbinder]

Obviously, you haven't watched us play recently, because Zokora has played extremely well in our last two gsmes.:001_rolleyes:

Didn't see Wet Spam game but don't need to. Zokora is a second rate (at best) holding player. He works very hard and is fairly disciplined but what's the use as he can't pass, can't shoot, his tackling ain't great and he's not good in the air. Yeah I can really see Real Madrid wanting his talents.

[Rojoknapp]

Didn't see Wet Spam game but don't need to. Zokora is a second rate (at best) holding player. He works very hard and is fairly disciplined but what's the use as he can't pass, can't shoot, his tackling ain't great and he's not good in the air. Yeah I can really see Real Madrid wanting his talents.

While I would agree that he can't pass or shoot or be good in the air, his tackling is ok, and while I know that you have seen enough of Zokora to make a judgement of him, you would think slightly more of him if you had seen the West Ham game. He was excellent.

[choda]

It all depends in what position he plays. He has proven to be quite effective in his recent position.

He's had two years plus in his position and he's only been decent of late, and only decent by the way.

[gomessi]

He's had two years plus in his position and he's only been decent of late, and only decent by the way.

second that I think decent is being kind to him. Is he really much better than muamba.

[peterc]

He's had two years plus in his position and he's only been decent of late, and only decent by the way.

Under Ramos's reign who was playing in their rightful position, except for Robinson/ Cerny and Gomes?. Choda, you seem to have a very short memory.

[Shelfside]

I doubt the validity of this story,but by god do I want it to be true.As Real Madrid once bought Tomas Gravesen,there is maybe just a small glimmer of hope.And before the pedants point it out,yes Gravesen was a better player than Zokora.

[choda]

Under Ramos's reign who was playing in their rightful position, except for Robinson/ Cerny and Gomes?. Choda, you seem to have a very short memory.

Zokora still played 90% of his games under Juande as a dm. And actually Juande's moving people about wasn't that bad, often you could see what he was trying to do, it's just that nothing was working for him due to language difficulties or general adaptation to the league. He believes in flexibility of system, personal and versatility. And it worked spectacularly at Sevilla.

[JuicE]

I doubt the validity of this story,but by god do I want it to be true.As Real Madrid once bought Tomas Gravesen,there is maybe just a small glimmer of hope.And before the pedants point it out,yes Gravesen was a better player than Zokora.

LMFAO!

I have to agree mate!!!!! We won't exactly miss him will we?

Fair paly the guy tries fukking hard but he's miles behind Essien or my cousin Billy (he's Good)!

Let Real turn him into a Midfield go getting goal scorer! :001_rolleyes:

[peterc]

Zokora still played 90% of his games under Juande as a dm. And actually Juande's moving people about wasn't that bad, often you could see what he was trying to do, it's just that nothing was working for him due to language difficulties or general adaptation to the league. He believes in flexibility of system, personal and versatility. And it worked spectacularly at Sevilla.

Zokora was also playing at right back, Ramos's tactics could not have been that good, results speak for themselves. The language problem is a weak excuse, especially when Gus Poyet was with Ramos to sort out any communication problems, Ramos might have wanted to change too many tactics and the players were not adapting to his changes as quickly as he expected them too. Servilla is in La Liga, Spurs is in the Premiership, completely different leagues.

[olly27]

Zokora was also playing at right back, Ramos's tactics could not have been that good, results speak for themselves. The language problem is a weak excuse, especially when Gus Poyet was with Ramos to sort out any communication problems, Ramos might have wanted to change too many tactics and the players were not adapting to his changes as quickly as he expected them too. Servilla is in La Liga, Spurs is in the Premiership, completely different leagues.

Hold on a minute Pete...How often did Zokora play RB? Not often and mostly in pre-season if I remember correctly. He played at CB more often probably, and did well, notably at Man City in The CC and Pompey away being recent examples. Zokora has improved recently, and yes against West Ham was possibly his best game in a Spurs shirt but you have to look at the previous 100+ games or so he has started in the DM role.

I think 2 and a half seasons is enough time to judge someone on. I always liked his committment and his attitude but the ability lacks tremendously. I know he does a lot of hard work at times and his tackling isn't to bad but he is woeful with the ball, terrible - I haven't seen worse at this level. He can't really pass the ball simply, its under hit slightly, over hit slightly or is just totally inaccurate. How many times does he surge forward, which is great by the way, and it comes to absolutley nothing? He's a poor version of Sisokko (ex liverpool, now at Juve I think), and cant even be mentioned in the same breath as Makelele.

Love the guy for his attitude and to be fair he does seem to be improving, but any offers received should be given serious consideration.

[TURKISH]

I think his tackling is good. I just think his passing and lack of ability to command a midfield is his problem. He would do very well in a spanish league imo.

I would also like to add that he had probley been our most consitent player this season and has played very good.

[olly27]

I think his tackling is good. I just think his passing and lack of ability to command a midfield is his problem. He would do very well in a spanish league imo.

I would also like to add that he had probley been our most consitent player this season and has played very good.

Yeah thats fair enough - he has been one of the more consistent performers, and has done better sine Harry came in. Imagine him surging forward in the Spanish League, if he could just find a pass, which I think would suit him more perhaps.

However, if we received respectable offers they should be entertained.

[TURKISH]

Yeah thats fair enough - he has been one of the more consistent performers, and has done better sine Harry came in. Imagine him surging forward in the Spanish League, if he could just find a pass, which I think would suit him more perhaps.

However, if we received respectable offers they should be entertained.

Who would you like to be brought in? I think we need a intelligent ball winner who can pass the ball. Im a fan of toulalan but from the prem im not to sure. Would diarra be disciplined to be able to stay and hold? Veloso would be worth a punt and ive heard theres a russia bloke who is ment to be very good at dm but not sure of his name.

[olly27]

Who would you like to be brought in? I think we need a intelligent ball winner who can pass the ball. Im a fan of toulalan but from the prem im not to sure. Would diarra be disciplined to be able to stay and hold? Veloso would be worth a punt and ive heard theres a russia bloke who is ment to be very good at dm but not sure of his name.

Is the Russian bloke another one who plays for Zennit? Timoshoc (sorry about spelling!)or something he's called? Or is it somebody completely different?

I would go for Diarra, even though Veloso looks an ernormous talent. Diarra was superb last season and I think he would be a right little warrior for us. I think he would be prefect to be honest and Harry will get the best out of him. If we got Diarra I would be very excited.

[TURKISH]

Is the Russian bloke another one who plays for Zennit? Timoshoc (sorry about spelling!)or something he's called? Or is it somebody completely different?

I would go for Diarra, even though Veloso looks an ernormous talent. Diarra was superb last season and I think he would be a right little warrior for us. I think he would be prefect to be honest and Harry will get the best out of him. If we got Diarra I would be very excited.

Thats it whats is he like?

[olly27]

Thats it whats is he like?

From what I saw of Zenit in the UEFA etc..and from watching him play in the last world cup...he's looks quite good. Just remebered its the Ukraine he plays for not Russia. Would rather have Diarra personally though.

Found out how to spell his name!! Its tymoshuck and he's Zenits captain.

[olly27]

Turkish I came across this, its Scum fans I know but they discuss this guy about half way down the page, have a read:

http://arsenal-mania.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=22442&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=150

[TURKISH]

Ukraine is his nationality not russia so my bad. How on earth did you find that thread olly! It was 2006!

Lets see what january brings i suppose. Got to love zokora loyalty though he didn't talk up a move to madrid he just refused to believe it and put it down to paper talk.

[olly27]

Ukraine is his nationality not russia so my bad. How on earth did you find that thread olly! It was 2006!

Lets see what january brings i suppose. Got to love zokora loyalty though he didn't talk up a move to madrid he just refused to believe it and put it down to paper talk.

I just stumbled across it unintentionally!!! Didn't realise it was 2006 though..lol..

I love Zokora for his attitude towards Spurs...would never take that away from him.

January will be interesting for sure.

[peterc]

[QUOTE=olly27;117486]Hold on a minute Pete...How often did Zokora play RB? Not often and mostly in pre-season if I remember correctly. He played at CB more often probably, and did well, notably at Man City in The CC and Pompey away being recent examples. Zokora has improved recently, and yes against West Ham was possibly his best game in a Spurs shirt but you have to look at the previous 100+ games or so he has started in the DM role.

He did play RB on a few premiership matches under Ramos's reign, I cannot recall which ones, anyway, according to Choda he seems to think that he is our weakest midfielder and I tend to disagree with him, to be honest, I would rather we sell JOH than Zokora, I think that Zolora has more to offer to the team than JOH has.

I think 2 and a half seasons is enough time to judge someone on. I always liked his committment and his attitude but the ability lacks tremendously. I know he does a lot of hard work at times and his tackling isn't to bad but he is woeful with the ball, terrible - I haven't seen worse at this level. He can't really pass the ball simply, its under hit slightly, over hit slightly or is just totally inaccurate. How many times does he surge forward, which is great by the way, and it comes to absolutley nothing? He's a poor version of Sisokko (ex liverpool, now at Juve I think), and cant even be mentioned in the same breath as Makelele.

Love the guy for his attitude and to be fair he does seem to be improving, but any offers received should be given serious consideration.

Zokora is not the best midfielder, however, if we had a few more players that show the commitment he shows, we would have a more effective midfield. Totally agree, would sell him too for the right price, that goes for most of our midfielders.

[olly27]

[QUOTE]

He did play RB on a few premiership matches under Ramos's reign, I cannot recall which ones, anyway, according to Choda he seems to think that he is our weakest midfielder and I tend to disagree with him, to be honest, I would rather we sell JOH than Zokora, I think that Zolora has more to offer to the team than JOH has.



Zokora is not the best midfielder, however, if we had a few more players that show the commitment he shows, we would have a more effective midfield. Totally agree, would sell him too for the right price, that goes for most of our midfielders.


Aint that the truth Pete.

[choda]

Zokora was also playing at right back, Ramos's tactics could not have been that good, results speak for themselves. The language problem is a weak excuse, especially when Gus Poyet was with Ramos to sort out any communication problems, Ramos might have wanted to change too many tactics and the players were not adapting to his changes as quickly as he expected them too. Servilla is in La Liga, Spurs is in the Premiership, completely different leagues.

Hence, the comment on language or general adaptation difficulties Pete!

The point being that sometimes it was possibly overdone, but a lot of it has also been done by Redknapp, Bentley on the left, Lennon, Hudd playing attacking midfield at times and so on.

There aren't any concrete answers as to why Juande failed. It had to be language or adaptation and you never know he may have even turned it around spectacularly.

[choda]

He did play RB on a few premiership matches under Ramos's reign, I cannot recall which ones, anyway, according to Choda he seems to think that he is our weakest midfielder and I tend to disagree with him, to be honest, I would rather we sell JOH than Zokora, I think that Zolora has more to offer to the team than JOH has.



Zokora is not the best midfielder, however, if we had a few more players that show the commitment he shows, we would have a more effective midfield. Totally agree, would sell him too for the right price, that goes for most of our midfielders.

He's not the worst cm on current form, Jenas is. And Hudd has games that are the worst of the lot as he can't even run when he's having a torrid night.

[peterc]

Hence, the comment on language or general adaptation difficulties Pete!

The point being that sometimes it was possibly overdone, but a lot of it has also been done by Redknapp, Bentley on the left, Lennon, Hudd playing attacking midfield at times and so on.

There aren't any concrete answers as to why Juande failed. It had to be language or adaptation and you never know he may have even turned it around spectacularly.

The difference being, Harry has got us quite a few positive results, whilst this season Juande wasn't. or should I say after the CC final.

[peterc]

He's not the worst cm on current form, Jenas is. And Hudd has games that are the worst of the lot as he can't even run when he's having a torrid night.

But JOH, is one who has potential, has he Choda?:001_rolleyes:

[choda]

The difference being, Harry has got us quite a few positive results, whilst this season Juande wasn't. or should I say after the CC final.

And who is disputing that Pete?

Harry won't have trouble adapting or communicating as he was bred on this league. It may be a risk putting him in charge of Barcelona though, possibly, especially if his spanish is poor.

[choda]

But JOH, is one who has potential, has he Choda?:001_rolleyes:

Well they all had potential but they all got a chance in their position bar JoH. Maybe he'd fail too, but I don't see why he isn't being given a shot as he has had some blinders. He is crap on the left, but people shouldn't judge him on that as he is not designed for it.

[peterc]

And who is disputing that Pete?

Harry won't have trouble adapting or communicating as he was bred on this league. It may be a risk putting him in charge of Barcelona though, possibly, especially if his spanish is poor.


El Tel knew no Spanish and he did okay in Spain and I think that Harry wiill do okay there too. The difference between Jaunde and Harry is that Harry knows how to motivate the players whilst Ramos seemed to have the I am the boss attitude and I will tell you what to do where to play. That is my opnion.

[peterc]

Well they all had potential but they all got a chance in their position bar JoH. Maybe he'd fail too, but I don't see why he isn't being given a shot as he has had some blinders. He is crap on the left, but people shouldn't judge him on that as he is not designed for it.

The reason why he hasn't beeen given that chance is because two managers seem to think that JJ and Zokora can do a better job.

[Rojoknapp]

exactly. JOH is no more than a stopgap, unless he goes to a lesser club.

[choda]

El Tel knew no Spanish and he did okay in Spain and I think that Harry wiill do okay there too. The difference between Jaunde and Harry is that Harry knows how to motivate the players whilst Ramos seemed to have the I am the boss attitude and I will tell you what to do where to play. That is my opnion.

Okay... and who gives a shit?

Juande still won more trophies than El Tel and Harry put together at Sevilla in two years. They've won nothing since. It's not cut and dried, some things are more complicated in life. Some can adapt, some have a lot of difficulty adjusting to a new culture, way of football. And he did win one trophy for us and may have turned it around, who knows.

But I'm delighted to have Harry, he's the man for us, no risks with him that I can see, so it was the right call.

[choda]

The reason why he hasn't beeen given that chance is because two managers seem to think that JJ and Zokora can do a better job.

Well Harry is new and that last two lost their jobs, and part of that was that the central midfielders they used didn't work!

If Harry doesn't try something different or buy new ones he will hit a wall sooner or later as well.

Maybe Juande wanted cms but Commolli made a mess of signing them. Jol didn't want them by all accounts, thought the sun shined out of JJ's crack and believed in Zokora. Jol on Zokora, 'Zokora is one of the best in europe, believe me'. Word for word.

[gomessi]

Well Harry is new and that last two lost their jobs, and part of that was that the central midfielders they used didn't work!

If Harry doesn't try something different or buy new ones he will hit a wall sooner or later as well.

Maybe Juande wanted cms but Commolli made a mess of signing them. Jol didn't want them by all accounts, thought the sun shined out of JJ's crack and believed in Zokora. Jol on Zokora, 'Zokora is one of the best in europe, believe me'. Word for word.

didnt know that:scared: :thumbdown:

I hope harry doesnt think zok is the answer.

[choda]

didnt know that:scared: :thumbdown:

I hope harry doesnt think zok is the answer.

He said it the summer he signed.

[gomessi]

He said it the summer he signed.

I cant remember it but I will taje your word. MJ definatly seemed to have faith in him.

[LifeTimeYido]

I cant remember it but I will taje your word. MJ definatly seemed to have faith in him.

I remember one of Zok's 1st games in Europe for us and was thinking "Fcuk...what a player !!".......i havent said that again since.

He started so well for us...then as per tottenham talent usually goes....fell by the wayside.

[singapore spur]

to be blunt , outside of modric and maybe lennon none of our midfield would get in one of the top four teams midfield which is the standard we should be looking for , so we can argue about who is better zokora , joh or jj but none of them are good enough to take us up a level .
bids for all of em are welcome .

[peterc]

Okay... and who gives a shit?

Proven wrong does not make any excuses for childish responses, about time you grow up Choda.


Juande still won more trophies than El Tel and Harry put together at Sevilla in two years. They've won nothing since. It's not cut and dried, some things are more complicated in life. Some can adapt, some have a lot of difficulty adjusting to a new culture, way of football. And he did win one trophy for us and may have turned it around, who knows.

But I'm delighted to have Harry, he's the man for us, no risks with him that I can see, so it was the right call.

El Tel and Arry won more trophies here in England and what does that prove Choda??, Ramos's problem at Spurs is he had the wrong attitude and it was not easy for the players to accept. Arry will take us forward, not necessary to the next step, and not for long term either.

[peterc]

Well Harry is new and that last two lost their jobs, and part of that was that the central midfielders they used didn't work!

If Harry doesn't try something different or buy new ones he will hit a wall sooner or later as well.

Maybe Juande wanted cms but Commolli made a mess of signing them. Jol didn't want them by all accounts, thought the sun shined out of JJ's crack and believed in Zokora. Jol on Zokora, 'Zokora is one of the best in europe, believe me'. Word for word.

I can assure you that most managers know much more than any of us, I can't see JOH being the answer, he is a very average player.

[choda]

[

Proven wrong does not make any excuses for childish responses, about time you grow up Choda.



El Tel and Arry won more trophies here in England and what does that prove Choda??, Ramos's problem at Spurs is he had the wrong attitude and it was not easy for the players to accept. Arry will take us forward, not necessary to the next step, and not for long term either.[/QUOTE]

Proven wrong??? On what exactly? I didn't say Harry wouldn't make it in spain, just that if he couldn't adapt or communicate as well as he does here he might be in big trouble like Juande was.

Juande came here with medals coming out his ears, which was pretty much the same with Mourinho too. In life you can't predict all outcomes, you just make what you think are good bets Peter. You are the one that needs to grow up.

You are smug that Ramos failed when you provided no justification at the time for saying it other than seeing no faults in Jol and having your weiner up his backside. And after the cc you said, 'Okay I am convinced'.

[peterc]

[QUOTE=choda;117666]

Proven wrong??? On what exactly? I didn't say Harry wouldn't make it in spain, just that if he couldn't adapt or communicate as well as he does here he might be in big trouble like Juande was.

Juande came here with medals coming out his ears, which was pretty much the same with Mourinho too. In life you can't predict all outcomes, you just make what you think are good bets Peter. You are the one that needs to grow up.

You are smug that Ramos failed when you provided no justification at the time for saying it other than seeing no faults in Jol and having your weiner up his backside. And after the cc you said, 'Okay I am convinced'.

Read your posts and the answer is there for all to see. I recall saying that I was then convinced that Ramos was the right choice, however, thereafter I realised that I had stated that through the joy of winning the CC. At least, I have changed my views much less that you have Choda, as I said your views change faster than the speed of light.

[choda]

[QUOTE]

Read your posts and the answer is there for all to see. I recall saying that I was then convinced that Ramos was the right choice, however, thereafter I realised that I had stated that through the joy of winning the CC. At least, I have changed my views much less that you have Choda, as I said your views change faster than the speed of light.

What now, Peter?

[peterc]

[QUOTE=peterc;117668]

What now, Peter?

Just answered your post.