getting rid of ramos is pointless

[gomessi]

the ship is sinking lads and the captain is levy he has totally ****ed us up.

How the **** do you release defoe, keane and berbatov in less than a year:mad: :mad: :mad:

The set up of the club is shit, an absolute joke.

DL is 100% responsible!!!!!!

[gomessi]

why the **** have we got this gooner **** DC and DL running our club:mad: :mad: :mad:

[bocayid]

unfortunately the buck stops with the manager...chairman don't resign....

and to be fair if Ramos is so hot...Id like to think even with the 'limited 'talents we have....modric,pavlyushenko,bentley,lennon,jenas,b ale,gunter,bent,gomes etc etc we might get at least a point against Hull,Stoke etc....or maybe..and heres a thought...if we flood the midfield with one up...why then not use the said midfielders to build attacks rather than play it straight in to the forward?...

you know Jol got hammered for not being bang last.....

I liked him.....we should have given him a proper go...so we won the CC ..woopdey dooo

[berbzy 'G']

Here is who we should look to replace Ramos with:

- Bilic

- Mancini

- Venables

[choda]

I don't see the strikers leaving as the biggest issue. The biggest issue is we have no central midfield general, none. Jenas is very weak and Modric is still settling. We are a cake walk. And the general work ethic is very poor too. They are the two major issues.

Keane and Berbatov just prevented a relegation battle, but we always had a very weak central midfield in recent times.

But if we had a midfield and did build up to get chances to Bent he would have a field day. He scores.

[gomessi]

I don't see the strikers leaving as the biggest issue. The biggest issue is we have no central midfield general, none. Jenas is very weak and Modric is still settling. We are a cake walk. And the general work ethic is very poor too. They are the two major issues.
Keane and Berbatov just prevented a relegation battle, but we always had a very weak central midfield in recent times.

But if we had a midfield and did build up to get chances to Bent he would have a field day. He scores.

so choda whose fault is that. Not buying a dm :confused: Redknapp said a £15m bid came in for diarra. Arshavin saga was a total joke.

We were linked with veloso but Dl watched us in preseason and thought JJ could play as a dm:mad: and bent can replace berbatov:rolleyes:

JJ and zok are 2 pussies we all know that and modric will need time to settle, such a shame we didnt get a real dm player.

DL is to blame.

Everyone talks about playing 442 but its not like pav is setting the prem on fire being a foreigner and all that it will take him time.

We have 2 strikers one is 4th choice (bent) based on last season the other hasnt adjusted.

[berbzy 'G']

so choda whose fault is that. Not buying a dm :confused: Redknapp said a £15m bid came in for diarra. Arshavin saga was a total joke.

We were linked with veloso but Dl watched us in preseason and thought JJ could play as a dm:mad: and bent can replace berbatov:rolleyes:

JJ and zok are 2 pussies we all know that and modric will need time to settle, such a shame we didnt get a real dm player.

DL is to blame.

Everyone talks about playing 442 but its not like pav is setting the prem on fire being a foreigner and all that it will take him time.

We have 2 strikers one is 4th choice (bent) based on last season the other hasnt adjusted.

We do need Diarra, Poulson or Veloso. But we have to improve our league postion in order to attract players to the club.
We are so bad that when I pick up the papers and see an article about us being linked with Heskey. I start thinking to myself ''maybe he would be a good buy actually''. Thats how shite we really are to make me think that. So there is no point in getting excited about all these wierd and wonderful players unless we can start getting points to make them want to come to us.

[choda]

so choda whose fault is that. Not buying a dm :confused: Redknapp said a £15m bid came in for diarra. Arshavin saga was a total joke.

We were linked with veloso but Dl watched us in preseason and thought JJ could play as a dm:mad: and bent can replace berbatov:rolleyes:

JJ and zok are 2 pussies we all know that and modric will need time to settle, such a shame we didnt get a real dm player.

DL is to blame.

Everyone talks about playing 442 but its not like pav is setting the prem on fire being a foreigner and all that it will take him time.

We have 2 strikers one is 4th choice (bent) based on last season the other hasnt adjusted.

We don't know all the ins and outs, lets not kid ourselves and take itk as gospel, it clearly isn't most of the time. But Commolli did fail in his job, what ever way it happened. There were things that he had months to do and didn't accomplish.

There are things that are not down to him though. The work rate on the pitch for one. And don't you think if Ramos said, 'we HAVE to get better than JJ or Zok to play with Modric and we HAVE to get two definite top class strikers to replace Keane and Berb' that it would have happened? Don't you think that Ramos should have made it clear that was the priority, not all the wingers and playmakers we bought? Instead we only got two possibly top strikers and no midfield general or TWO like I would go for as cover.

He made JJ vice captain and he always plays him, hail rain or shine, however many times he gets outdone and beaten in midfield. And he rates Zokora, didn't sell him like others, picked him in the CC final bafflingly ahead of Tainio and he nearly threw it away giving away free kicks and missed a sitter. Still plays him.

To be honest I think he desperately wanted the wingers as much or more because we didn't buy wingers under Jol. Jol didn't want them, played cm's out wide usually and all of a sudden we are buying wingers. A lot of that had to come from Ramos's input. I also wanted wingers but the priority was players to shore up and win or at least match teams in central midfield.

Perhaps when the spanairds come over here and get power and vetos on transfers they never had before they are quite inexperienced at it and f*ck it up initially or take years to build a team properly like Rafa seems to finally be doing only now.

I think Commolli and Ramos have both f*cked up. However much Commolli messed up, the performances have not been right going back to the CC final, the work rate is not right and shape is not right and that is down to Ramos.

As I say I'd give him to January and if we haven't turned the corner he has to go. Commolli has to go already.

[gomessi]

We don't know all the ins and outs, lets not kid ourselves and take itk as gospel, it clearly isn't most of the time. But Commolli did fail in his job, what ever way it happened. There were things that he had months to do and didn't accomplish.

There are things that are not down to him though. The work rate on the pitch for one. And don't you think if Ramos said, 'we HAVE to get better than JJ or Zok to play with Modric and we HAVE to get two definite top class strikers to replace Keane and Berb' that it would have happened? Don't you think that Ramos should have made it clear that was the priority, not all the wingers and playmakers we bought? Instead we only got two possibly top strikers and no midfield general or TWO like I would go for as cover.

He made JJ vice captain and he always plays him, hail rain or shine, however many times he gets outdone and beaten in midfield. And he rates Zokora, didn't sell him like others, picked him in the CC final bafflingly ahead of Tainio and he nearly threw it away giving away free kicks and missed a sitter. Still plays him.

To be honest I think he desperately wanted the wingers as much or more because we didn't buy wingers under Jol. Jol didn't want them, played cm's out wide usually and all of a sudden we are buying wingers. A lot of that had to come from Ramos's input. I also wanted wingers but the priority was players to shore up and win or at least match teams in central midfield.

Perhaps when the spanairds come over here and get power and vetos on transfers they never had before they are quite inexperienced at it and f*ck it up initially or take years to build a team properly like Rafa seems to finally be doing only now.

I think Commolli and Ramos have both f*cked up. However much Commolli messed up the performances have not been right going back to the CC final, the work rate is not right and shape is not right and that is down to Ramos.

As I say I'd give him to January and if we haven't turned the corner he has to go. Commolli has to go already.

choda you could be correct about jj but I was under the impression he was given the (c) because he is the only player who has been here any length of time.

also regarding zok who is crap. we dont have many players who are better JOH and hudd are both shit, same with boateng.

It really is disgraceful how ramos is ****ing up as well. Even without arshavin, diarra we shouldnt be ROCK BOTTOM!!

ramos is to blame for the way we are playing and DC + DL are to blame for not securing the players - I guess I am agreeing with you. BUT DC ****ed up big time in not getting a dm!

Also seeing mod and bentley show so little in terms of trying to take control of the game is really shocking - talented players who are not stepping up:(

By january if we dont have 20 points, 18 minimum it will be very difficult to get out of this shit

[choda]

choda you could be correct about jj but I was under the impression he was given the (c) because he is the only player who has been here any length of time.

also regarding zok who is crap. we dont have many players who are better JOH and hudd are both shit, same with boateng.

It really is disgraceful how ramos is ****ing up as well. Even without arshavin, diarra we shouldnt be ROCK BOTTOM!!

ramos is to blame for the way we are playing and DC + DL are to blame for not securing the players - I guess I am agreeing with you. BUT DC ****ed up big time in not getting a dm!

Also seeing mod and bentley show so little in terms of trying to take control of the game is really shocking - talented players who are not stepping up:(

By january if we dont have 20 points, 18 minimum it will be very difficult to get out of this shit

JoH is not shit, fact. He controlled the game in central midfield on his debut at the emirates last year in the league with his passing and tackling. He is far from shit, just a young player going through a dip in confidence which will pick up with game time and better players than Jenas beside him. He always knows the right way to try to control the game and is way more solid even on a bad night. Hudd is too slow in a two anyway. What we need is some kind of way like Corluka, JoH and Modric until January. Or in a three Hudd is acceptable as back up with JoH and Modric. I'd even try Boeteng again, he is strong and can't be worse than Zokora or Jenas.

[fluke]

I'm writing this as someone who, I admit, was fully into getting rid of Jol and bringing in Ramos. I'm also pro the "give them time to gel" bollocks. But guys, there is a big difference between starting badly and being the worst team in the league. I really can't believe that we are struggling against teams like Stoke.

Now I think Ramos ,if you look at his record is a world class manager. If we bear this in mind then something has to be wrong elsewhere. We would therefore be talking about the Chairman or the DOF or both. The chairman, despite fan pressure, is unlikely to fire himself and for some reason the DOE seems incapable of accepting any blame or be made culpable by his employers so what happens next?

The transfer window is a long way off. I saw lots of nice one touch stuff in midfield but who is going to score? Jenas, Modric and Bentley seem incapable of shooting on target. In fact they are all as equally inept of this talent from dead ball situations as they are from open play.

I really do understand how we got so bad. Quite simple really, we sold our best strikers. Now I see many posts saying how we need this player and that player, but realistically, if you were one of these world class players, would you risk signing for the worst team in the Premiership?

I would have to say that I am as pessimistic now as I was optimistic during pre-season. Does anyone have any encouraging words?

[Rojoknapp]

JoH is not shit, fact. He controlled the game in central midfield on his debut at the emirates last year in the league with his passing and tackling. He is far from shit, just a young player going through a dip in confidence which will pick up with game time and better players than Jenas beside him. He always knows the right way to try to control the game and is way more solid even on a bad night. Hudd is too slow in a two anyway. What we need is some kind of way like Corluka, JoH and Modric until January. Or in a three Hudd is acceptable as back up with JoH and Modric. I'd even try Boeteng again, he is strong and can't be worse than Zokora or Jenas.

actually he can. he is shit.

[Indianspur]

Fluke Modric can shoot, he scored a 18 yarder for croatia midweek!
He has some power for a little guy..give him a chance he;s only played a handful of games. its not like we have to watch him be shit for 3-4 years like Jenas and still be allowed to take setpieces and the captaincy!

[berbzy 'G']

Modric will be gone by the end of the season. Whatever postion we are inn. Modric is a cocky c*nt and will want out

[Rojoknapp]

they'll all want out. only zokora will remain loyal.

[choda]

actually he can. he is shit.

Can't be worse.

[Rojoknapp]

he can honestly. he really is an utterly horrendous excuse for a footballer. anyway, how come you want to get rid of jj and zok (who i agree weren't good) but no mention of modric, who was dreadful today, and probably gave the ball to stoke more times than to our players!

[choda]

he can honestly. he really is an utterly horrendous excuse for a footballer. anyway, how come you want to get rid of jj and zok (who i agree weren't good) but no mention of modric, who was dreadful today, and probably gave the ball to stoke more times than to our players!

Because A. he's been here five minutes B. he's proven himself on a HIGHER level and C. he's a miles better footballer, you can see it, it's just not happened for him yet. It's also very hard to come to a new country to a new team that is not playing well and settle quickly.

At least we know Boeteng will tackle and impose some presence in midfield. What do Jenas and Zokora do well in the middle of the park? I don't see anything, and I mean anything really constructive, unless you like brainless training cones with little ability that show impressive acceleration now and again.

Jenas does good spurts of running (whoopsy do) but he can't tackle, he doesn't read situations well and make good decisions defending and attacking, he switches off and he gives the ball away or crabs it sideways all day.

Zokora just has a bigger set of testicles but even less 'ability' and 'potential'. They're both chronically and pathologically useless. I'd whore them out all over europe like a pimp desperately trying to get money to score some heroin.

And why is Taarabt getting frozen out? At least he would give us some spark and forward thrust. He's a huge talent, quick, big, strong, skillful as anything. He's too young to be frozen out. Is anyone telling me he wouldn't be better than what Bentley has done so far? Just needs to get his head up more.

[Apples]

Because A. he's been here five minutes B. he's proven himself on a HIGHER level and C. he's a miles better footballer, you can see it, it's just not happened for him yet. It's also very hard to come to a new country to a new team that is not playing well and settle quickly.

At least we know Boeteng will tackle and impose some presence in midfield. What do Jenas and Zokora do well in the middle of the park? I don't see anything, and I mean anything really constructive, unless you like brainless training cones with little ability that show impressive acceleration now and again.

Jenas does good spurts of running (whoopsy do) but he can't tackle, he doesn't read situations well and make good decisions defending and attacking, he switches off and he gives the ball away or crabs it sideways all day.

Zokora just has a bigger set of testicles but even less 'ability' and 'potential'. They're both chronically and pathologically useless. I'd whore them out all over europe like a pimp desperately trying to get money to score some heroin.

And why is Taarabt getting frozen out? At least he would give us some spark and forward thrust. He's a huge talent, quick, big, strong, skillful as anything. He's too young to be frozen out. Is anyone telling me he wouldn't be better than what Bentley has done so far? Just needs to get his head up more.


Finally a mention of the man's name - I don't care if people think he's so much of a showboater he unlocks defences when he played against arsenal before he made them all look like mugs!

He should be given a chance for sure on the left, Lennon on the right...who knows about centre but I would as u say give Bostock a go what do we have to lose there!!!!!!!!!

I dont care play some youth and talent - like arsenal did a CC games - risky but i think they would do much better than the useless rubbish we have out there now!

Also Dos Santos should be in the side above Modric at the mo.

[rodkralik]

[QUOTE=juandes soldier;108314]
also regarding zok who is crap. we dont have many players who are better JOH and hudd are both shit, same with boateng.

I agree with alot of what you say, juandes, but I rate O'Hara. He has a technichal ability which has developed, and he has SPIRIT. He comes out with a warrior intent to win a game, and a determination to make a difference. Play has a greater focus about him, and that comes through character when it's translated into influence. Ramos could do worse than play an essentially young team with Woodgate, Bentley and O'Hara as centres of inspiration and see if they can't just charge their way through to January and some points. I know, it won't make getting a cohesive team together in the New Year easy, but we need something unexpected.



Also seeing mod and bentley show so little in terms of trying to take control of the game is really shocking - talented players who are not stepping up:([QUOTE=juandes soldier;108314]


I agree, but the mid-field should be managed by JJ as captain and a cm, and if there's a vacuum there in terms of authority then stepping up could be seen as a challenge to JJ's position. We can't play three games out of four with a vice-captain pretending to be the real thing, minus the the genuine authority and, possibly, respect of his team mates.

[rodkralik]

I dont care play some youth and talent - like arsenal did a CC games - risky but i think they would do much better than the useless rubbish we have out there now!

We disagree about some things, but whilst I was typing away so were you, and you're right, it's risky but for a while it could be glorious.

[Rojoknapp]

for the first time this season i am seriously having the contemplate relegation. I don't see what we can do about things in jan because who would join us? we may be forced into a west ham job, relegation buy out clauses and ridiculous wages. I am shitting myself, i don't know what i would do if we went down.

[berbzy 'G']

for the first time this season i am seriously having the contemplate relegation. I don't see what we can do about things in jan because who would join us? we may be forced into a west ham job, relegation buy out clauses and ridiculous wages. I am shitting myself, i don't know what i would do if we went down.

We can't rely on just buying new players in January anyway. We have to sort it out now with the manager and players we have right now.

[mjbmedia]

Getting rid of Ramos is pointless???

Well we only have TWO points now so it wont hurt us too much.
Having said that i dont want that to happen , we cant go back in time so we're stuck with what we've got and as Boca Yid says quite rightly, if Ramos is as good as sooo many of you on here said he was when he was being wooed last season, then he should still be able to do a hell of a lot better with the players we have (which every single signing, o/than Bent perhaps, was worshipped and excitedly welcomed by 95% of you at the time).
Even if he hasnt got everyone he wanted , do you think any manager gets everyone he wants?, he should still be able to do and get much much more from them that he's currently getting, so that part IS TOTALLY his fault.

As for Comolli , well ive been saying for the last 3 seasons hes a useless waste of a seat in the ground, But Levy likes useless waste of spaces like Kemsley, and look where listening to hims got us!!!!!

[peterc]

Getting rid of Ramos is pointless???

Well we only have TWO points now so it wont hurt us too much.
Having said that i dont want that to happen , we cant go back in time so we're stuck with what we've got and as Boca Yid says quite rightly, if Ramos is as good as sooo many of you on here said he was when he was being wooed last season, then he should still be able to do a hell of a lot better with the players we have (which every single signing, o/than Bent perhaps, was worshipped and excitedly welcomed by 95% of you at the time).
Even if he hasnt got everyone he wanted , do you think any manager gets everyone he wants?, he should still be able to do and get much much more from them that he's currently getting, so that part IS TOTALLY his fault.

As for Comolli , well ive been saying for the last 3 seasons hes a useless waste of a seat in the ground, But Levy likes useless waste of spaces like Kemsley, and look where listening to hims got us!!!!!

Spot on MJB, the main problem now with Ramos is, are the players still backing him?, a few have stated so, but are they really?. Playing 4-5-1 formation that has failed time after time, wrong tactics, players must have had enough by now.

[mjbmedia]

its weird, cos when Ramos first started here, hed do some really 'strange' substitutions and positioning of players midway thru matches and theyd work .
That was supposedly before he'd really got to 'know' the players.
Now he 'knows' them, he doesnt ever do those strange things and as a result we just whimper to defeat after defeat.