CL Match Thread: TOTTENHAM HOTSPUR v Werder Bremen

[Gino Ginelli]

UEFA Champions League - Group A
24th Nov 2010 - KO 19:45 - White Hart Lane

Spurs can secure qulaification for the knock out stages of the champions league this wednesday with a win against Werder Bremen. The last euroepan night at the Lane saw us record an emphatic and glorious triumph over the holders Inter Milan, so confidence is high that we can repeat that performance.

With King, Dawson and Huddlestone still out, and Lennon struggling for fitness and form, I would expect a similar lineup to that we saw in the second half against Arsenal, with Defoe making his first start alongside Pavluchenko. Despite struggling to impose himself in the first half against the Gooners, the big Russian displayed some fine touches and passing in the second half, and with Defoe adding that extra dimension now, Pav should have more freedom to be his usual predatory self.

Having said that, expect Crouch to feature in the second half.

--------------- Gomes ---------------
Hutton --- Gallas --- Kaboul --- Ekotto
------ Jenas --- Modric ---- Bale -----
----------- Van Der Vaart ------------
---------- Defoe --- Pavluchenko ----

Gallas to be captain again.

http://www.independent.co.uk/multimedia/dynamic/00457/obtismithPA_457161t.jpg

http://www.tottenhamhotspur.com/uploads/assets/240x359/history/spurs_honours.jpg

[earl warwick]

I'd question Defoe starting, as we face Liverpool on Sunday. 2 and a half games in 9 days is stretching it, unless he can come off after 60-70 minutes.

Bremen got hammered 4 nil by a Schalke side in the bottom 3 at the weekend.

Bremen's last 3 results: 0-6, 0-0, 0-4.

That's set-up for us to finish off the job, especially as Inter are also in free-fall and it's on a plate to top the group.

3 nil - Crouch, Gallas, VDV

[earl warwick]

It took a while but a hint of life did eventually return to Klaus Allofs's pale face, along with one minute, positive thought. "We didn't make any new mistakes today," it occurred to the sporting director in the concrete bowels of the Veltinsarena. "Unfortunately, though," he continued with a grimace, "we made all the old ones again."

No one could dispute Werder Bremen's consistency in that respect. They had started well enough away to Schalke, in "the summit of frustration" (Die Welt). But then the first goal by Christoph Metzelder saw them disintegrate like Waldmeister-flavoured Ahoj Brause in a glass of fizzy water. A hat-trick from Raúl made the result doubly misleading: Schalke weren't all that good to have won 4-0, Werder much too bad. Double figures wouldn't have surprised anyone.

"Apart from [Tim Wiese], you can all go home," the 6,000 travelling supporters sang when some players tried to apologise after the final whistle. About a hundred irate fans stayed behind to block the team bus from leaving. Per Mertesacker had to get out and promise more effort next time. The next day, there were rumours that hardcore supporters might stage a protest outside the training centre; two police man were dispatched, just in case. Nothing in fact happened, but discontent in the citystate has probably never been more keenly felt. In easy-going, unhurried Bremen, they don't whisper the word crisis lightly. Now, they're screaming it from the rooftops.

"We don't write 'relegation battle' on the board but there is no point thinking about the Champions League [for next season]," conceded Allofs. They're 12th in the table, only four points clear of Bundesliga 2 doom. In the Champions League, they're all but out. Confidence before the daunting trip to White Hart Lane on Wednesday couldn't be lower. On top of it all, there is another injury. Brazilian jack-of-all-trades Wesley (hamstring) won't travel.

Allofs is right: Bremen's inability to defend is nothing new. But this season, they seem to have taken their notorious open-door policy to a new extreme: there is no longer any door to speak of, only a vast thoroughfare, with free, guaranteed passage to anyone who happens to be in the vicinity. Away to Inter (0-4), the northerners were so soft that Gazzetta dello Sport dubbed them "Werder Crema". A less polite headline writer might have changed "Werder" to a similar sounding Italian word starting with an "m". "We're dreaming, we're ball-watching, we're doing nothing," said the coach Thomas Schaaf. "Everyone's delighted to play against us at the moment."

In the absence of Brazilian Naldo, the comedy double-act of centre-backs Sebastian Prödl and Mertesacker is plumbing deeper depths than local pop heroes Klaus & Klaus in their heyday. The less said about Mickaël Silvestre and other faux full-backs, the better. Unfortunately for Werder, their chronic deficits at the back are no longer offset by sublime attacking football. Mesut Özil's departure to Real Madrid has left too big a gap in the creative department. Neither Marko "The Austrian Ibra" Arnautovic, who unhelpfully combines the megalomania of Zlatan with a fraction of his talents, nor the more defensively minded Wesley have been able to make a real difference going forward. And "in midfield, Torsten Frings acts like a diva who believes she's still seeing yesterday's beautiful reflection in the mirror", wrote Süddeutsche Zeitung. "He elegantly dispatches long balls into areas where someone used to make runs in the past, but where there's only the sorry Hugo Almeida standing around offside these days."

Increasingly, the finger of blame is pointing to Allofs, who seems to have been deserted by his sure touch in the transfer-market. A distinct lack of useful young, home-grown players compounds the trouble and it's obvious that Schaaf, the grumpiest man in German football, doesn't have any answers either. "We only have these players and we only have one plan. There is no plan B and no plan C. We simply have put our plan into action much better," he insisted. "Schaaf is in danger of destroying his own monument," wrote Die Welt.

The €60m stadium renovation has reduced the margin of error for this expensive team dramatically. Even more worryingly for Werder, Bild revealed that Schaaf has already offered his resignation in a team-talk last week. Where can they go from here? Allofs tried to scare the team into submission by freezing part of the wages in October. That trick only worked for a couple of weeks, until the missing thousands were paid out, along with November's wages in full.

"There is no fight in the team. We break apart immediately when things don't go according to plan," said the midfielder Aaron Hunt, a man who seems lost in lethargy, like his team-mate Tim Borowski. Allofs's fortunes have always been closely tied to those of Schaaf - they've both been in charge since 1999 - but the 53-year-old won't hesitate to put the knife in before he goes down himself. The 0-4 at 04 was the "worst day" in his time at Bremen, he said, before putting just a touch of daylight between him and the moustachioed coach. "I still believe [Schaaf] is the right man for the job but that's not a dogma," he said carefully. The end of an era? It looks as if it might have begun.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/blog/2010/nov/22/werder-bremen-end-of-an-era

[Gino Ginelli]

Wow, and there are some who think we have problems!

As for Defoe, that's exactly what I'd expect. Given a half or 60 mins then withdrawn for Crouchy.

[mjbmedia]

Gomes
Hutton, Bassong, Kaboul, BAE
JJ, Modric, Palacious, Bale
VDV
Crouch

Defoe to come on for VDV with say 55 mins gone . We need to rest Gallas in this one for Sunday , Bale to be subbed after 60/70 if we are cruising
Subs if fit, Cudicini, Corluka, Gallas, Bentley, Lennon , Defoe, Pav .
JJ on the right to hopefully help defend Marin

[irishspur]

Strongest team available for me, no talk of resting gallas or defoe. Do we really want to go over to holland needing a win to qualify? Finishing above inter would be massive if we can match their results. Its the difference between playing barca/copenhagen or real madrid/milan. My team
-------------Gomes------------
Hutton---Gallas---Kaboul---BAE
VDV----Jenas-----Modric---Bale
----------Defoe---Crouch-------

Prediction 4-1 to the spurs with van der vaart and defoe on the scoresheet.
Pace will be key as their two centre backs are less mobile than peter crouch!

[earl warwick]

Gomes
Hutton, Bassong, Kaboul, BAE
JJ, Modric, Palacious, Bale
VDV
Crouch

Defoe to come on for VDV with say 55 mins gone . We need to rest Gallas in this one for Sunday , Bale to be subbed after 60/70 if we are cruising
Subs if fit, Cudicini, Corluka, Gallas, Bentley, Lennon , Defoe, Pav .
JJ on the right to hopefully help defend Marin
Major failure there, mjb, in committing the common "Palacios" spelling error. :stoned:

Gallas should be on a high from Saturday, even after struggling in the last few minutes, and neither he nor Kaboul are likely to face much of a test from Bremen. He has to start to get a deserved ovation from the fans, especially those arses that have been booing him.

I don't see why Bentley shouldn't start on the right. Be a bit radical and start VDV centre in place of Modric.

[deadleyledley]

they seem to be in the shits.

team i would play:

gomes
hutton gallas kaboul BAE
vdv jj modric bale
defoe pav

same as the 2nd half against scum. get defoe off at 60mins for crouch.

[Rojoknapp]

I said it on the other thread about Bremen but I'll put it in this one anyway - I really don't think Rafa on the right is a good idea when we know the danger of Marin. We also all know how exposed our right flank is when VDV plays there, and we all know how good a defender Alan Hutton is :001_rolleyes: Rafa on the right wing will just give Marin endless opportunity to run at Hutton, and it was bad enough the first time round with a proper right winger in front of Charlie who is actually a better defender than Hutton.

[NDC123]

JJ on the right to hopefully help defend Marin

While I dont actually mind having Jenas playing for this game please dont put him in the side to be defensive cover, thats the thing he's worst at - he'll jump out of a challenge rather than jump into it.

[TURKISH]

Crouch is fantastic in europe, teams can't deal with him and he must start. One of the first names on my team sheet.

[Gold7]

While I dont actually mind having Jenas playing for this game please dont put him in the side to be defensive cover, thats the thing he's worst at - he'll jump out of a challenge rather than jump into it.

I think your being a bit unfair there mate.
Jenas puts his foot in as much as any other spurs player and does plenty of defensive work. I take your point about being a back 4 protector is probably not his strength . Jenas has been great of late.

I reckon strongest possible eleven fast start try to get enough goals to make game safe then bring off Bale , VDV and gallas or Defoe if he starts.

[Antilokhos]

Strongest team available for me, no talk of resting gallas or defoe. Do we really want to go over to holland needing a win to qualify? Finishing above inter would be massive if we can match their results. Its the difference between playing barca/copenhagen or real madrid/milan. My team
-------------Gomes------------
Hutton---Gallas---Kaboul---BAE
VDV----Jenas-----Modric---Bale
----------Defoe---Crouch-------

Prediction 4-1 to the spurs with van der vaart and defoe on the scoresheet.
Pace will be key as their two centre backs are less mobile than peter crouch!
It's not a question of resting Defoe, it's a question of his fitness. Defoe was looking tired at the end of 45 minutes. It makes more sense to bring him on late (say the last 25-30 minutes) and have him able to go 60-70 against Liverpool. Especially when we have a proven European goalscorer like Crouch.

I would seriously consider starting Krancjar on the left. Yes, Bale has been fantastic, but we are running him into the ground. He needs to start being rested, and I think we can still be dangerous enough with VDV and Luka that we can afford Bale.

Plus, I'm really getting annoyed with Harry with regards to his handling of Niko.

[GodGomes]

We should rest Lennon for Bentley and Kranjar for Bale. Lennon has been playing like he's afraid of an injury on Saturday and Bale has played EVERY match since the start of the season for 90 Minutes. If this continues on it won't be long before Bale picks up a fatigue injury or something that keeps him out for a couple of months. Believe me if that happens.....

[TURKISH]

Bale doesn't need a rest especially ahead of a huge european game. If we win on Wednesday we can rest him away from home at Twente. Bale is the fittest player we have, plus the players don't train that much because they have games midweek. If we leave him out that could really spur Werder on and give them a huge belief they can beat us.

If your gonna rest players make sure you do it at the right time, Werder Bremen at home is a huge must win game.

Niko shouldn't get sympathy vote just because he played well for Croatia, the bloke has been dog shite for us this year and looks unfit. Plus he just moves inside all the time, lacks pace and at the moment we need pace.

The only way your gonna get players match fit is by playing games, I would rest Defoe on Wednesday purely because I would rather him score against Liverpool. A 30 minute run out could sharpen him up for Liverpool, plus Pav has done well.

My team:

-------------Gomes------------
Hutton---Gallas---Kaboul---BAE
VDV----Jenas-----Modric---Bale
----------Pav---Crouch-------

If everything goes well bring on Defoe, Niko and Lennon.

[GodGomes]

Bale doesn't need a rest especially ahead of a huge european game. If we win on Wednesday we can rest him away from home at Twente. Bale is the fittest player we have, plus the players don't train that much because they have games midweek. If we leave him out that could really spur Werder on and give them a huge belief they can beat us.

If your gonna rest players make sure you do it at the right time, Werder Bremen at home is a huge must win game.

Niko shouldn't get sympathy vote just because he played well for Croatia, the bloke has been dog shite for us this year and looks unfit. Plus he just moves inside all the time, lacks pace and at the moment we need pace.

The only way your gonna get players match fit is by playing games, I would rest Defoe on Wednesday purely because I would rather him score against Liverpool. A 30 minute run out could sharpen him up for Liverpool, plus Pav has done well.

My team:

-------------Gomes------------
Hutton---Gallas---Kaboul---BAE
VDV----Jenas-----Modric---Bale
----------Pav---Crouch-------

If everything goes well bring on Defoe, Niko and Lennon.


I agree. However maybe we should start with Lennon and gradually build up his confidence again

[TURKISH]

I agree. However maybe we should start with Lennon and gradually build up his confidence again

You could but its a gamble, I would personally go 442 and have a right go at Werder. If things are going well or shit you then have the luxury of bringing Lennon on.

I personally think Lennon needs a kick up the jacksie, maybe dropping him for VDV or Bentley can spur him on.

BTW, welcome to the forum pal.:santaclaus:

[GodGomes]

I personally think Lennon needs a kick up the jacksie, maybe dropping him for VDV or Bentley can spur him on.

BTW, welcome to the forum pal.:santaclaus:

Thanks :ciao:

And true maybe benching him for a couple of games would work.

[Rojoknapp]

While I dont actually mind having Jenas playing for this game please dont put him in the side to be defensive cover, thats the thing he's worst at - he'll jump out of a challenge rather than jump into it.

Of all the players on the field, only Gallas (6) made more tackles than JJ in the Arsenal game (5).

[TURKISH]

Of all the players on the field, only Gallas (6) made more tackles than JJ in the Arsenal game (5).

Apparently stats don't show the whole picture...:001_rolleyes:

[GodGomes]

Besides, Werder are playing like limp lettuce from what I've heard. Spurs play very well at home. Should be a piece of cake......

[deadleyledley]

I think JJ is more than capable of putting his foot in. if you remember 2 of the goals that bale scored against inter at the san siro, it was jj who won the ball off the inter players.

must win game. so we need to play out strongest team and whip off bale and vdv and defoe if he starts.

im having second thoughts on the striking partnerships.

i said defoe and pav. but i think now that crouch and pav is the best way and bring defoe on around 60mins.

[GodGomes]

i said defoe and pav. but i think now that crouch and pav is the best way and bring defoe on around 60mins.

Starting with Crouch is dodgy. He performs better when brought on during 2nd half.

[Gino Ginelli]

Besides, Werder are playing like limp lettuce from what I've heard. Spurs play very well at home. Should be a piece of cake......

You're new to supporting Spurs aren't you? :biggrin:

[GodGomes]

Just optimistic :)

I turn a blind eye to inconsistency.

[deadleyledley]

Starting with Crouch is dodgy. He performs better when brought on during 2nd half.

he performs well in europe, so it shouldnt be that bad.

good scoring record.

[NDC123]

I think JJ is more than capable of putting his foot in. if you remember 2 of the goals that bale scored against inter at the san siro, it was jj who won the ball off the inter players.


Defending is more than about 'putting your foot in' anyone can do that. The things he can't or wont do are tackle, track or mark opponents - all very important defensive attributes. If he's in the side we should be telling him to get into the area & hopefully grab or set up a goal, they are things that he is better at but no matter how much anyone worships him surely even they can't realistically say he's good defensively!

[deadleyledley]

Defending is more than about 'putting your foot in' anyone can do that. The things he can't or wont do are tackle, track or mark opponents - all very important defensive attributes. If he's in the side we should be telling him to get into the area & hopefully grab or set up a goal, they are things that he is better at but no matter how much anyone worships him surely even they can't realistically say he's good defensively!

:dito:

i agree with you there, but his main downfall is his lack of concentration thoughout the game. this is where he comes undone. you say he doesnt track and that is due to lapses in concentration.

he is much better attacking than defending no doubt about it, but he doesnt seem to do either. normally he goes sideways, but i can see a change coming about him and recent performaces indicate that.

[deadleyledley]

i think its important that we score as many goals as we can tommorow, to make sure that we stay top of the table.

however, i would rather we keep a clean sheet first and win.

[corkspur]

VDV and Bale are doubts for tomorrow night.would be a big loss.

[NDC123]

i think its important that we score as many goals as we can tommorow, to make sure that we stay top of the table.

however, i would rather we keep a clean sheet first and win.

Doesn't it go on head to head record if its us & Milan on equal points? Either way i'd take a 1-0, 2-1, 3-2 etc win now! Something tells me this game won't be as easy as we'd like to think.

[Gino Ginelli]

Of course it won't. It would take a silly team indeed to think that they could rest on their laurels and have an easy game after recording a famous victory.

... wait, wut?

[NDC123]

VDV and Bale are doubts for tomorrow night.would be a big loss.

They would be. Not only tomorrow but a big game against Liverpool on Sunday too. Either of them not on the teamsheet would give Bremen a massive lift

[earl warwick]

Doesn't it go on head to head record if its us & Milan on equal points? Either way i'd take a 1-0, 2-1, 3-2 etc win now! Something tells me this game won't be as easy as we'd like to think.

Yes, it does.

I think it will be as easy as it appears.

The collapses of Bremen and Inter have given Spurs a stunning opportunity to top the group. Bremen will be more concentrated on not dropping into the bottom 3 in the Bundesliga.

[kingled]

Lets start the game attacking and a fast pace and blow ze germans away.

----Larry Gomes----

Hutton---Gallas---Kaboul---BAE

Bentley--Wilson--JJ--Modric

--------Van---------

------Crouch-------

[GodGomes]

----Larry Gomes----

Hutton---Gallas---Kaboul---BAE

Bentley--Wilson--JJ--Modric

--------Van---------

------Crouch-------

I beg your pardon.

[Gino Ginelli]

----Larry Gomes----

Lol, very clever!

I beg your pardon.

You don't follow cricket then? :001_smile:

[mjbmedia]

COYS lets qualify one match early , lets top the group , lets do better than Arsenal

[deadleyledley]

COYS lets qualify one match early , lets top the group , lets do better than Arsenal

possibilty that they wont even qualify.

think that winning today is imperative. next would be a nice clean sheet to take into the liverpool game.

[earl warwick]

Gomes, Hutton, Gallas, Kaboul, BAE, Bale, Lennon, Jenas, Modric, Pav, Crouch.

Subs: CC, Keane, Palacios, Krankie, Defoe, Corluka, Bassong,

[mjbmedia]

Cant honestly see them losing to PArtizan

[TURKISH]

Fantastic from Lennon!!!!!!!!! Kaboooooooom!!!!!!!:santaclaus:


YIDO YIDO YIDO YIDO!!!

[earl warwick]

Modric has had another poor first half, and then...

VDV level of quality.

:santaclaus:

[Gino Ginelli]

Poor first half, despite being 2 up and Gomes having nothing to do. Modric has been poor, Lennon mostly awful. A lot of players guilty of slacking off, losing concentration and not showing for the ball. Pav very wasteful in front of goal, should have scored two by now.

Two tidy goals though, I hope Harry drills some focus back into them at half time. We don't won't a repeat of the last game we played against these guys.

[TURKISH]

Struggled since JJ has went off, not got out of first gear really. Lennon, Modric, Pav and Crouc should be doing more imo. Modric struggling playing alongside someone who doesn't have a clue how to pass and move.

Defoe can get a couple of goals here and up the tempo.

[MarlowSpurs]

Should have been 3.

[TURKISH]

Knew he would miss, why isn't Pav taking the pen?

[MarlowSpurs]

Come on Lennon you useless ****

[TURKISH]

Rodney you PLONKER!!!!!

[TURKISH]

Fantastic qualified already from the group with a game spare.:santaclaus:


Liverpool next.

[Gino Ginelli]

You'll have to forgive me memory, but I really can't think of an easier 3-0 victory than that.

To be quite honest we played quite shite; sloppy passing, minimal movement and some wayward finishing. We saw what VDV gives us in a 4-5-1 now, someone who drops deep and shows for the ball. The 3 central units looked very isolated from one another. The 2 CB's would struggle to get the ball out with the two CM's rarely showing, and the front pairing in the second half offered little to link up with them. This resulted in Kaboul regressing to 2007 and hoofing the ball to Crouch all the time.

But then 90% of that game saw us playing with no one but ourselves. Werder Bremen practically didn't show up. A team with more to play for would have made us pay for those lapses, but then you could argue that we would have actually been in a game then and would have been sharper.

Still, some great individual moments saved the day, Kaboul staying up for his opener, Modric's classy finish for the second, and Lennon's fancy footwork and cut back allowing Crouchy to succeed where Pav had failed twice in the 1st half.

So, Champions League Knockout's here we come. Back to the real world with Liverpool next.

COYS!

[TURKISH]

Not gonna read to much into the performance, Werder was rubbish and we never needed to get out of first gear. Which is fantastic considering we have Liverpool on Sunday and we shouldn't be emotionally drained.

A good solid professional performance, a few players sloppy with their passing but I'm not too bothered really.

[peterc]

Although we played a poor opposition, we managed to win comfortably. Great to qualify for final sixteen. Modders MOTM for me. COYS.

[TURKISH]

http://d.yimg.com/i/ng/sp/empics/20101124/21/848387920-24112010210615.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs485.ash2/75854_476084997940_745062940_5664783_7055369_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1166.snc4/150808_476079487940_745062940_5664734_6943537_n.jp g

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1166.snc4/150808_476079487940_745062940_5664734_6943537_n.jp g

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1166.snc4/150808_476079487940_745062940_5664734_6943537_n.jp g

http://d.yimg.com/i/ng/sp/p5/20101124/21/4059396266.jpg

[matthius23]

Just got home... I know Bremen aren't the toughest team we'll play in our CL adventure - but what a frighteningly easy win!

Modric was just fantastic tonight, and Wilson put in a very good shift (gave the ball away a few times, but he wouldnt be Wilson if he didnt.) Lennon found much more space in the 4 man midfield... 2 assists is a great contribution.

Great to see JD as hungry as ever... goal against Liverpool on Sunday anyone?

Two meter Peter held the ball up very well, and won pretty much everything.

Only downers were JJs early injury, and another poor showing from Pav!

[GodGomes]

The Bale and Lennon wing show is spectacular. Lennon's nutmeg for Crouch's goal ^^

[deadleyledley]

nice win and finally a clean sheet. need one in the league now against liverpool on sunday.


onwards and upwards.