Match Thread: Manchester United v TOTTENHAM HOTSPUR

[Gino Ginelli]

Barclays Premier League - 30th Oct 2010 - KO 17:30 - Old Trafford

The saturday evening KO sees us travel to Old Trafford for a stern test against an otherwise inconsistent Man Utd side. Unbelievably the word at the moment is that Mark "back-hander" Clattenberg is set to officiate the game. So no matter how damn well we play, and how many goals we "score", we are destined to be cheated out of a penalty or two at some stage.

My team:

---------------- Gomes ---------------
Hutton --- Kaboul --- Gallas --- Ekotto
------- Huddlestone --- Modric -------
Lennon ------ Van Der Vaart ----- Bale
------------- Pavluchenko ------------

COYS!

http://www.independent.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00402/mendes_402991d.jpg

[Rojoknapp]

Anyone is better than Webb.

[Apples]

---------------- Gomes ---------------
Hutton --- Kaboul --- Gallas --- Ekotto
------- Huddlestone --- Modric -------
Lennon ------ Van Der Vaart ----- Bale
---------------- KEANE ------------

My team:

Payluchecko and Crouch are two of the worst centre forwards you could play in a team full of such talented football players

[NDC123]

The problem with this fixture is that its 11 v 14 (15 if you count the 4th official) I don't believe Clattenburg should ever get this game again. I was at the game where Mendes scored & everyone in the ground knew it was a goal even the Manure fans couldnt deny it yet Clattenburg still disallowed it. Then again i dont suppose it matters who the ref is as they all give them ridiculous decisions! This is the main reason they are near the top of the league every year

[Indianspur]

Ive got my ticket therefore we will win or draw....only ever seen a loss by spurs in 2002/3 when ive gone to a match to bolton and gary doherty was playing conceding a last min pen!
btw i am only able to go to a few games a season!

[mjbmedia]

Ive got my ticket therefore we will win or draw....only ever seen a loss by spurs in 2002/3 when ive gone to a match to bolton and gary doherty was playing conceding a last min pen!
btw i am only able to go to a few games a season!
Quick get this man a season ticket!!

Look we can make excuses about refs all we like, fact is we've rarely deserved to win at OT, we've capitulated too often against Man U.
But now we are CL material, we should not be so overawed by them, haha yeh OK.

We have to stop Chico , Im hoping VDV is seriously up for this one, Lennon to get Evra booked in first 5 minutes, Bale to terrorise the incredibly speedy Neville . I can see a Tony Pulis moment where either of those two stay on the pitch despite a clear second bookable offence, I can see us , yes us getting a penalty at OT , will we score it? Yeh VDS is passed it now

[matthius23]

I'd rather see Bassong and Kaboul as starting CBs... if Gallas cant handle Yakubu and Saha (see Everton game,) he will get embarrassed by Hernandez and Berba. Pav to start over Crouch... give him 90mins... Crouch should be dropped after his Everton performance.

Was there an Everton MOTM thread by the way?

[Gino Ginelli]

Ive got my ticket therefore we will win or draw....only ever seen a loss by spurs in 2002/3 when ive gone to a match to bolton and gary doherty was playing conceding a last min pen!
btw i am only able to go to a few games a season!

You have some serious skills my friend to avoid any defeats over the last 8 years :adore:

[malc123]

Our record at OT is seriously depressing. I have watched in hope too many times to see either them rolling us over or us putting up a fight before a dodgy ref decision denying us a goal or giving them a penalty or a man advantage. Yes MU look more vulnerable at the moment but they have not lost this season or for some time before that. Our players must feel the same feeling of impending doom and have one eye on tuesday.
As to our form, it was better when we played them straight after the Scum/Chelsea wins last year and we still lost. We could not even win against a weaken team in the League Cup.
A win for me would be unbelievable and I think I would not believe it was going to happen if we were 2-0 up with 90 mins up.
I hope to be proved wrong but I doubt it.

[deadleyledley]

this team is one of the best talent wose i have seen for nearly 20 years. im hoping that they are up for it and do not crumble under the pressure.

dont want to hear the excusses about ref decisions although they have been really bad.

my team:

gomes
hutton gallas kaboul ekotto
lennon hudd modric bale
vdv
pav

crouch doesnt merit a start tommorow. think pav is a much better player by himself but is his combination with vdv as good as crouchy's?

[deadleyledley]

News that Tom huddlestone is out for tomorrows game. Jj will have to step in but I won't be surprised if sandro or palacios play.

[mjbmedia]

whats up with Tom now then? will he be OK for Tuesday?
Id play Sandro to be honest as he cant play Tuesday anyway so give him the whole game

[Gino Ginelli]

I'm not sure throwing the still adapting Sandro into the Man Utd game would be a good idea. Normally Palacios would be a shoe in to play, but has proved little other than his ability to get booked at an alarming rate in recent games. I would suggest JJ, but he's much more a box to box type, as opposed to a holding player.

I actually think Palacios and JJ would be a good choice, I remember the two of them being an excellent CM partnership in Harry's first season in charge. However with Modric available then that won't happen, and with good reason. Having said all that though, I'd like to see Harry put some faith into his youngsters and give Sandro a run out after all. You never know, he may do a "Rose".

[BruceGroveN17]

Sandro is a better passer, reads the game well and he can run with the ball

I Just hope Lennon wakes up and starts taking on fullbacks again..rather then cutting in all the time.

[Rojoknapp]

Modders and JJ for me, Palacios has done nothing to deserve a place over JJ who has been very good this season, and it would be throwing Sandro in at the deep end.

Welcome to the forum Bruce :001_smile:

[StevenYTID]

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/3203657/Benoit-Assou-Ekotto-Wayne-Rooney-is-a-dirty-prostitute-shaer.html#ixzz13nTCMkuO

Oh dear....

[choda]

I think we can get a draw from this one.

And I think it is a chance to win, as this is the worst United team in twenty years, particularly in midfield and defence.

I'd like to see Pav start over Crouch, but either way it is a weak area in our side but we are sensational in midfield. I expect us to have very strong spells of domination. I just hope we can convert that into goals.

[Defoe8]

Don't want to hearing any excuses about the Inter game being the main focus, NO NO NO!
The league has to be our main focus, whether we get out the CL group or not we'll never win the competition this season obv, and so we need to make sure we're in it nxt season as well, and the season after that etc..

Last season 2 of Untd's players tormented us in particular - Giggs and esp Nani, our full backs were given a torrid time, and the Portugese winger in particular ripped us a new arsehole in the away game at OT last season. So it'll be vital Hutton/Benoit are on the ball, which also means Bale and Lennon must track back and help them out.

Whoever plays in DM will need to get tight to Scholes, if he's given any sort of room guaranteed he'll either set up a goal or score, like he's done countless times against us in particular.

Don't think we'll win, draw is the best hope, but think we'll lose :thumbdown:

[berbzy 'G']

Clattenberg gives two penalties, send off Modric for blowing his nose, lose

LMFAO!!! so true :lol: :lol: :lol:

We won't win at Man Utd, we never do, we always f*ck it up somehow. The referee never helps either. Speaking of referees, is it Howard Webb? because if Webb is refereeing today then it's just going to be a matter of how many penalties Man Utd win by?

[Apples]

Anyone know where this game will be streamed?

I have to go over my girlfriend's house and no ESPN, sky sports so was hoping i can watch the game on the laptop.

Your urgent advices would be most appreciated : D

[Antilokhos]

We have as good a chance as ever to win but I am not hopeful. Outside of VDV and Bale, we seem to have nobody interested in scoring consistently, and that's not going to work at Old Trafford.

[earl warwick]

Gomes; Hutton, Kaboul, Gallas, Assou-Ekotto; Lennon, Jenas, Modric, Bale; Van der Vaart; Keane.

Subs v United - Cudicini, Bassong, Palacios, Sandro, Kranjcar, Pavlyuchenko, Crouch.

[StevenYTID]

Keane?

Fanfckingtastic......

[Antilokhos]

Anyone know where this game will be streamed?

I have to go over my girlfriend's house and no ESPN, sky sports so was hoping i can watch the game on the laptop.

Your urgent advices would be most appreciated : D
Here is a pretty good looking SOPcast stream:
sop://broker.sopcast.com:3912/90521

[Legend10!]

I know we aint got much to choose from upfront, but why play our most out of form striker!

Cant wait to hear harry explaining himself with that choice!

[matthius23]

C'mon Keano.

Great that City have now lost 2 in a row... I said the other day to my mate that we just need to be matching their results week in week out. A point today would be fantastic.

[Yido Iz LiFe]

Anyone with any Links?

[GPK]

The Sopcast link above is pretty decent.

Jenas is back to old ways of giving the ball away far too much - even when not under any pressure.

[Antilokhos]

Anyone with any Links?
Tons of links here, the best I've found is the SOPcast I posted earlier.

http://www.myp2p.eu/broadcast.php?matchid=91323&part=sports

[Antilokhos]

Did anybody not see that one coming? As soon as I saw Nani lining up I knew they were scoring off of that.

[matthius23]

That's cruel... we were well in the game. Need more from Jenas and Keano.

[GPK]

No surprises with Clattenberg's performance so far....
Gallas - commits 1 foul and gets a yellow
Kaboul - commits 1 foul and gets a yellow

Neither or the challenges were particularly bad, certainly free kicks. Neither warranted cards. FFS

[MarlowSpurs]

Fvck me that deserved a goal

[matthius23]

No surprises with Clattenberg's performance so far....
Gallas - commits 1 foul and gets a yellow
Kaboul - commits 1 foul and gets a yellow

Neither or the challenges were particularly bad, certainly free kicks. Neither warranted cards. FFS

Hutton and BAE will join thec lub at the earliest oportunity... Clattenberg will want to complete the full set.

[Apples]

We have as good a chance as ever to win but I am not hopeful. Outside of VDV and Bale, we seem to have nobody interested in scoring consistently, and that's not going to work at Old Trafford.

Thanks Anti

Well I think we are playing pretty well

enjoying the football

just need that cutting edge up front

Man U are very lucky to be leading

COYS

[Antilokhos]

I think Keane has done fairly well, he's made a lot of good runs and has opened up space for VDV. It's a little depressing watching VDV out there, he's so much better than everybody else we have. I mean, Bale is great, Modric is a hell of a player, but they can't even begin to touch the footballing intelligence and technical ability that VDV has.

I can't say we've done all that terribly bad, but we don't look too likely to score either. We have no aerial presence so I wouldn't be surprised to see Keane taken off for Crouch or even Pav.

[choda]

Very good game, unlucky to be behind.

But what on earth were we doing at the set piece. Our smallest defender on their best header. Madness.

Undone by stupidity when we are growing into the game more and more at the most difficult ground to go to in the country.

Still a long way to go. The forwards are linking very well, Keane's movement is drawing them back and as a result Van der Vaart is picking the ball up a lot in space which is resulting in a number of good situations.

The only downside is a stupid set piece, and Jenas who is back to awful. We can get a draw or better out of this if Jenas improves or is replaced by someone who doesn't give it away so much.

I'd also like to see Bale help out Ekotto a bit better at times instead of just stanging there and leaving him one on one.

[matthius23]

Very good game, unlucky to be behind.

But what on earth were we doing at the set piece. Our smallest defender on their best header. Madness.

Undone by stupidity when we are growing into the game more and more at the most difficult ground to go to in the country.

Still a long way to go. The forwards are linking very well, Keane's movement is drawing them back and as a result Van der Vaart is picking the ball up a lot in space which is resulting in a number of good situations.

The only downside is a stupid set piece, and Jenas who is back to awful. We can get a draw or better out of this if Jenas improves or is replaced by someone who doesn't give it away so much.

I'd also like to see Bale help out Ekotto a bit better at times instead of just stanging there and leaving him one on one.

Quite right Choda... maybe some of the nicest football we've played all season - and to be honest, with VDV on the pitch, I think we can achieve anything! :santaclaus:

[choda]

Thanks Anti

Well I think we are playing pretty well

enjoying the football

just need that cutting edge up front

Man U are very lucky to be leading

COYS

We've created good positions and Keane's movement has been very good, we just aren't delivering the final ball to the wingers or Keane to open them up. But this is old trafford and we should be level and looking to go on, which is very encouraging.

A goal for us would see them rattled. But it never ceases to amaze me how Fergie gets his teams energy through the roof, they are very hard to play and he always gets them playing well. On paper that team isn't great at all.

[choda]

I'd like to see Sandro on for Jenas. And more concentration and confidence with the final ball. Go for it.

[Antilokhos]

I'd like to see Niko get on for Bale. Bale is doing ok, but he desperately needs some sort of rest, and I think Niko is raring to go given how he's been ignored all year.

I'm fairly disappointed with our wide play today although it looks like Modric is more and more getting back to his best.

[Antilokhos]

Keane played well, opened up a lot of space for VDV. Hopefully Pav feels like showing up today and can make some good runs to keep VDV going.

[Antilokhos]

They can complain all they want, Gomes was stupid there.

[matthius23]

What just happened?

[Antilokhos]

Nani was laying on the ground, trying to milk a penalty, he picked up the ball, the referee waved play on, Gomes picked the ball up and set it down to take a free kick, assuming that the referee saw Nani holding the ball. Nani walked up and kicked the ball in.

[matthius23]

They took an eternity to show a replay of the whole passage of play... Nani and Clattenberg go **** yourselves.

[Antilokhos]

Clattenberg is retarded, again. But it's hard to blame Nani for that, he did exactly what I would have expected a Spurs player to do. Gomes seemed to show some pretty poor decision making on the play, and I just can't fathom how stupid Clattenberg is.

[peterc]

How could he award that as a goal after Nani handled the ball, obvious it was meant to be a foul for diving orelse that idiot, of a so called red would have awared a penalty. What a ****ing prick.

[choda]

It's awful communication to the players from the ref, but ultimately Gomes's fault for not being on the ball.

Nani is on the ground with the ball in his hand, so if he played on he'd get the advantage. It makes no sense to play the advantage there. Gomes picks it up for a free kick, does he look at the ref and query how he stands?

Does the ref shout at the keeper and wave advantage to make sure he knows?

No, he doesn't he's still thinking about the pen decision he just made and feeling the heat. Bad refereeing, but ultimately Gomes's fault for not seeing what the ref was doing next.

[choda]

How could he award that as a goal after Nani handled the ball, obvious it was meant to be a foul for diving orelse that idiot, of a so called red would have awared a penalty. What a ****ing prick.

Not a foul doesn't always mean he was awarding a dive or a free for a dive. But he was handling the ball on the ground so you can't play advantage from there because Nani had the ball. That is where the contention is.

The ref wasn't in the present and Gomes wasn't looking for a decision he assumed, which was also wrong.

They are both at fault and both could have prevented it.

[choda]

Keane played well, opened up a lot of space for VDV. Hopefully Pav feels like showing up today and can make some good runs to keep VDV going.

Yea, he did in a difficult game.

That's one of the main reasons why I think 352 would suit us best at the moment. You'd have a physical presence up front with Pav and his goals, Keane's or Defoe's movement and his goals and VDV in the deeper position off the front he likes to play in. More cutting edge, more options and you still have that brilliant little player making things happen from deep.

[choda]

I'd like to see Niko get on for Bale. Bale is doing ok, but he desperately needs some sort of rest, and I think Niko is raring to go given how he's been ignored all year.

I'm fairly disappointed with our wide play today although it looks like Modric is more and more getting back to his best.

Yea, I agree. I think Harry is putting too much on Bale at times. His game is largely based on extraordinary athleticism so you have to take the pressure off him at times.

He needs to give more responsibility to Lennon and use Niko more at times in the wide areas.

Bale can't be the main outlet and constantly run like a machine in every game. We have plenty of good players and a deep squad.

[choda]

Another point about the second goal: Everybody at home has seen the incident. The old video thing again. One look, two look, five seconds, no goal. Free kick for handball because he's not seen it or he can't play advantage in that situation because Nani had control of the ball after the handball, which means it still goes back to a free kick.

Once again it goes back to fifa as well.

Our game is a bit of a farse because it is run so badly. Every week there is injustice and contention and every so often we have huge injustice.

A lot of poorly defined or indefinable type rules, poor refs, poor ref assessments, poor post game assessment and no video when it can be used so easily. Joke.

Football is a great sport, but it is in many ways a joke as well. Unfortunately.

Total muppets run our game.

[deadleyledley]

Very good game, unlucky to be behind.

But what on earth were we doing at the set piece. Our smallest defender on their best header. Madness.

Undone by stupidity when we are growing into the game more and more at the most difficult ground to go to in the country.

Still a long way to go. The forwards are linking very well, Keane's movement is drawing them back and as a result Van der Vaart is picking the ball up a lot in space which is resulting in a number of good situations.

The only downside is a stupid set piece, and Jenas who is back to awful. We can get a draw or better out of this if Jenas improves or is replaced by someone who doesn't give it away so much.

I'd also like to see Bale help out Ekotto a bit better at times instead of just stanging there and leaving him one on one.

kaboul was marking him and never tracked him all the way across.

[SCIFIN17YID]

I was very busy yesterday so I counld watch the game, does anyone have a link to watch this silly nani goal ?

[peterc]

Not a foul doesn't always mean he was awarding a dive or a free for a dive. But he was handling the ball on the ground so you can't play advantage from there because Nani had the ball. That is where the contention is.

The ref wasn't in the present and Gomes wasn't looking for a decision he assumed, which was also wrong.

They are both at fault and both could have prevented it.

My error, foul should have read free kick. Nani handled the ball, that is a handball, definitely NOT accidental. Ref should have listened to the assistant who tried to explain to Clattenberg that Nani handled the ball, this was after Gomes ran to the assistant, all our players were asked to move away whilst discussions went on, but Ferdinand (not even captain on the day) was allowed to listen in and maybe try and influence the outcome, favouritism at its best, but ref decided to give an advantage.

[Indianspur]

My day ruined by the ref! Would have probably enjoyed the last 7 minutes etc even if we lost but to have farcical decisions kill the game off is ridiculous.
i paid 45 quid and deserve a full 90 mins of football.

We need a striker and harry needs to have more ideas with the team. poor kranjcar...

[mjbmedia]

the thing that pissed me off most after the Nani incident was none of our players showed any bother, no passion, no lets get even , nothing.
They had a number of chances to go in fair and hard into challenges and nobody hardly even made a tackle, let alone a hard one , but then o yes they were quick to show passion towards the ref at the end again werent they, look you useless overpaid muppets, show passion during the match.
Where was the pride, where was the emotion, where was the passion ??
No good bloody moaning about the decision after the game, do something about it when those players are still on the pitch .

Ref gave little to useless information signals to Gomes, you can clearly see it all on the ESPN showing , Gomes was clearly asking is it a free kick, the ref just ignored him, but then look at Clattenburgs reaction when Nani puts it in, you can see hes saying 'good serves you right' just by his body language.
He aint even worth getting angry over.

[Shelfside]

Bad refereeing decisions in favour of United at OT aren't exactly uncommon,particularly against us,so it's not even worth bothering with.
For me the real disappointment was the fact that we genuinely had a chance to win this game and whilst we looked comfortable,we offered only a token threat going forward.
This result wouldn't have been so bad if we had beaten Wigan or Everton.Those are the games in which you pick up the maximum points as insurance for when you go to places like OT or The Emirates or Stamford Bridge.We have to take charge of our season and not keep relying on Man City slipping up because there are quite a few teams closing in on us and another couple of bad results could see us slip down to mid-table.
We have to pick ourselves up straight away for the Inter match and put in a knockout performance to get this United defeat/injustice/groundhog day out of our system.

[deadleyledley]

we know that clattenburg is a muppet and that he should never have got this game again after mendes' goal, but i think that his reaction to the situation was very poor. he was told by the lino that it was a handball and that the free-kick should be given. the thing that annoys me most about this is that gomes was clearly asking is it a free-kick and clattentburg just shurgged his shoulders sayin he doesnt know.

if you are a ref and you dont know what is going on then im sorry but your should hang your whistle up and go into retirement.

performance wise we had some good possession but nothing really meaningful where we attacked them with power and force. there was the token shot taken from long range and not enough movement in and around the box. it is hard to do that with only keane up top on his own. vdv came too deep to collect the ball and just crowded the midfield even more when they went into 4-5-1 formation.

pav took more shots and looked more likely to score but on the day we lacked that extra quality with the final ball.

[Ginola's Son]

What happened last night didnt surprise me, I always expect our humiliation to be worse than the last at OT, same old shit, different day, quite literally

Clattenberg is a **** and can't referee, this we know. But Gomes should never put the ball down when there is a player behind him, even if he thinks he's down on the ground or what, its a cardinal error at a ground where a goal FOR united will ALWAYS be given whatever the circumstance.

Had it happened at the other end, Clattenberg would have laughed at us while obviously disallowing it.

I'm happy to default this pointless affair every year, waste of time and energy. Just hand them the points.

[Rojoknapp]

If Clattenberg doesn't see the handball (he is a moron after all) then when he talks to the linesman he has to give it, the linesman must tell him it was handball, and Clattenberg has to bring it back. If he's playing advantage, which is what Redknapp says Clattenberg claims he was doing, then he has to give a very clear signal - both arms forward, and shout advantage so everyone knows what's going on. Instead, the jumped up prick just stands there like a f*cking mong shrugging his shoulders. Why can't we just go to Old Trafford and lose like everyone else? Why do we have to humiliate ourselves or be robbed every f*cking season?

[denis-cro]

any update about severity of VDVs injury ?? Is he going to be fit to face Inter tomorow ??

[Gino Ginelli]

What happened last night didnt surprise me, I always expect our humiliation to be worse than the last at OT, same old shit, different day, quite literally

Clattenberg is a **** and can't referee, this we know. But Gomes should never put the ball down when there is a player behind him, even if he thinks he's down on the ground or what, its a cardinal error at a ground where a goal FOR united will ALWAYS be given whatever the circumstance.

Had it happened at the other end, Clattenberg would have laughed at us while obviously disallowing it.

I'm happy to default this pointless affair every year, waste of time and energy. Just hand them the points.

Yeah, I always write this one off as well.

Doesn't stop me from continuing to be utterly disgusted at the lack of fairness, quality refereeing, and blatant fvcking shite that goes down in this game every year.

[Ginola's Son]

Guess we got lucky decisions go our way at Stoke and Fulham - but I'd trade them both in for ONE SINGLE SHRED of justice taking place at OT.

[spursmadnick06]

For as long as I can remember we have been getting cheated at Old Trafford. Was watching my old childhood 95-96 season review VHS not to long ago. In the game at Old Trafford that season United were awarded a free kick near their own penalty box which their centre back took quickly and played it out to Neville at right back who wasn't concentrating, Sheringham was concentrating, ran on to the ball and was through on goal for a likely goal and of course the ref called the game back. Our players and Gerry Francis were fuming and I remember his post match comments 'United are going to have no trouble winning the title, coz you never get a decision here'.

Nothing has changed, I won't bother watching this fixture next season.

[mjbmedia]

Guess we got lucky decisions go our way at Stoke and Fulham - but I'd trade them both in for ONE SINGLE SHRED of justice taking place at OT.
6 points gained V an outside potential for a draw ?

Ok im being a git, I know and agree with you in essence. maybe next season.

Dennis it seems VDV is out for tomorrow, is Hudd back?

[deadleyledley]

6 points gained V an outside potential for a draw ?

Ok im being a git, I know and agree with you in essence. maybe next season.

Dennis it seems VDV is out for tomorrow, is Hudd back?

on the official spurs facebook link it says that vdv and hudd are back in contention to play against inter.

will have to wait for official team news tommorow on the web.

[mjbmedia]

yes over the day it appears good news for VDV , started off out of the game now looking more rosy.