The loss of Defoe...

[olly27]

Ok so it was a stupid act of petulance and now we lose our top scorer for 3 games, 2 league games and a CC game against Everton - and aint to bothered about losing him for that one.

Stoke did well against the Pikey's yesterday, Beatie and Fuller could prove to be a handful next week, however if Ledley plays I expect their threat to be nullified somewhat. Up top it will be Crouch and Keane, with Pav as an option from the bench. I really hope Robbie is on form next week, if he is we will win comfortably I expect as we will have far too much for them going forward. Wouldn't be at all surprised if its the same score line as last season - 3-1.

However if Robbie has a quiet afternoon it could be a dodgy game for me, we need an influential Robbie next week to link the attacks and finish a move or two off. A nice week of rest for the likes of Lennon to recharge his batteries and particularly Wilson. We should be ok for the win, I just hope its not a repeat of the Birmingham game.

The big loss is obviously the NLD. Defoe is in good form and had he stayed on the pitch at Pompey you would of fancied him to get another. We will miss his cutting edge and his sharpness infront of goal for sure. Maybe Pav will make a welcome impact in the next few games, possibly his last chance to make a real impression and he certainly will have a point to prove.

So JD wont be back until Sunderland at home in 3 weeks time. If we pick up 4 points in the next two league games we will have done well in his absence. Hopefully Modric will feature in the NLD, and both will be back (proper) to face the Mackems.

Thoughts?

[peterc]

Ok so it was a stupid act of petulance and now we lose our top scorer for 3 games, 2 league games and a CC game against Everton - and aint to bothered about losing him for that one.

Stoke did well against the Pikey's yesterday, Beatie and Fuller could prove to be a handful next week, however if Ledley plays I expect their threat to be nullified somewhat. Up top it will be Crouch and Keane, with Pav as an option from the bench. I really hope Robbie is on form next week, if he is we will win comfortably I expect as we will have far too much for them going forward. Wouldn't be at all surprised if its the same score line as last season - 3-1.

However if Robbie has a quiet afternoon it could be a dodgy game for me, we need an influential Robbie next week to link the attacks and finish a move or two off. A nice week of rest for the likes of Lennon to recharge his batteries and particularly Wilson. We should be ok for the win, I just hope its not a repeat of the Birmingham game.

The big loss is obviously the NLD. Defoe is in good form and had he stayed on the pitch at Pompey you would of fancied him to get another. We will miss his cutting edge and his sharpness infront of goal for sure. Maybe Pav will make a welcome impact in the next few games, possibly his last chance to make a real impression and he certainly will have a point to prove.

So JD wont be back until Sunderland at home in 3 weeks time. If we pick up 4 points in the next two league games we will have done well in his absence. Hopefully Modric will feature in the NLD, and both will be back (proper) to face the Mackems.

Thoughts?

Bearing in mind that Pav has just returned from injury, let's hope that he will be fully fit.

[choda]

I'm not too bothered mate, I have to say.

JD is in great form and he's a finisher, but you see people saying all over the place that we might lack a cutting edge when he is missing.

In case anyone hasn't noticed Keane's long term record for spurs is better (even before Defoe was benched) and his record this year is good too. And his international record is superb, and in recent times he has 6 in 8 games for Ireland. How much more proven do people want?

And he's far more influential in general play and has far less quiet games than Defoe.

It seems people expect Keane to link the play AND score as many as JD and JD only has to score. I don't really understand that.

And Crouchie is a top player, he can come in and score goals and create them.

I don't care who scores the goals and at times with Keane and Crouch it will be others that they've brought into the game. I've zero worries about JD being missing as I think he's replaceable team wise.

I'm not sure we wouldn't miss Keane over a spell of games.

I'd ideally like JD for the Arsenal game but then again they are a small side and Crouch could be a real problem for them.

[olly27]

I'm not too bothered mate, I have to say.

JD is in great form and he's a finisher, but you see all over the place that we might lack a cutting edge when he is missing.

In case anyone hasn't noticed Keane's long term record for spurs is better (even before Defoe was benched) and his record this year is good too. And his international record is superb, and in recent times he has 6 in 8 games for Ireland. How much more proven do people want?

And he's far more influential in general play and has far less quiet games than Defoe.

It seems people expect Keane to link the play AND score as many as JD and JD only has to score. I don't really understand that.

And Crouchie is a top player, he can come in and score goals and create them.

I don't care who scores the goals and at times with Keane and Crouch it will be others that they've brought into the game. I've zero worries about JD being missing as I think he's replaceable team wise.

I'm not sure we wouldn't miss Keane over a spell of games.

I wasn't trying to turn this into a Keane V Defoe debate!! Just saying that I feel Keane needs to be on form next week otherwise we may struggle to get on top. Ceraintly not one who expects Keane to do everything and score as many as JD.

But I disagree with you mate, in that I would much rather have Defoe in the team than out of it...reason: he will be our top scorer this season, and anyone wants their top scorer in the side.

[choda]

I wasn't trying to turn this into a Keane V Defoe debate!! Just saying that I feel Keane needs to be on form next week otherwise we may struggle to get on top. Ceraintly not one who expects Keane to do everything and score as many as JD.

But I disagree with you mate, in that I would much rather have Defoe in the team than out of it...reason: he will be our top scorer this season, and anyone wants their top scorer in the side.

I'd like him in the side too, but I'm not sure he'll be the top scorer is what I am saying.

I don't think it will effect us to be honest. We will still have top quality and proven scorers on the pitch and an eager sub with lots of talent on the bench as well.

I don't really see any lack of ingredients in what we will have to score as a team.

For example: Keane will play further up when JD is missing. He does what they team needs on the day.

[olly27]

I'd like him in the side too, but I'm not sure he'll be the top scorer is what I am saying.

I don't think it will effect us to be honest. We will still have top quality and proven scorers on the pitch and an eager sub with lots of talent on the bench as well.

I don't really see any lack of ingredients in what we will have to score as a team.

For example: Keane will play further up when JD is missing. He does what they team needs on the day.

Thats very true. I know what your saying, we have enough quality in forward positions for it not to effect us. All I am saying is I would rather have him in the side than not. I still think Keane and Defoe will cause the most problems, although I love Crouchy and the threat he can pose to.

I have a feeling that Keane and Lennon will destroy Stoke next week but I expect us to leak a goal as well.

[Antilokhos]

I think our top scorer is going to be whoever plays with Keane the most. Right now that has been Defoe, I think if it was a Crouch and Keane partnership then Crouch would have a similar amount of goals, same for Pav. Keane is an excellent creator. So yeah, it'd be better to have Defoe available, but we are going to be dangerous going forward as long a we have Modric or Keane available. Lennon is still a bit too inconsistent for my taste to be included with those two.

[TURKISH]

I'm not too bothered mate, I have to say.

JD is in great form and he's a finisher, but you see people saying all over the place that we might lack a cutting edge when he is missing.

In case anyone hasn't noticed Keane's long term record for spurs is better (even before Defoe was benched) and his record this year is good too. And his international record is superb, and in recent times he has 6 in 8 games for Ireland. How much more proven do people want?

And he's far more influential in general play and has far less quiet games than Defoe.

It seems people expect Keane to link the play AND score as many as JD and JD only has to score. I don't really understand that.

And Crouchie is a top player, he can come in and score goals and create them.

I don't care who scores the goals and at times with Keane and Crouch it will be others that they've brought into the game. I've zero worries about JD being missing as I think he's replaceable team wise.

I'm not sure we wouldn't miss Keane over a spell of games.

I'd ideally like JD for the Arsenal game but then again they are a small side and Crouch could be a real problem for them.

I never had you down as a keane fan myself.

[choda]

I think our top scorer is going to be whoever plays with Keane the most. Right now that has been Defoe, I think if it was a Crouch and Keane partnership then Crouch would have a similar amount of goals, same for Pav. Keane is an excellent creator. So yeah, it'd be better to have Defoe available, but we are going to be dangerous going forward as long a we have Modric or Keane available. Lennon is still a bit too inconsistent for my taste to be included with those two.

I'd say that's exactly how Harry sees it as well. Another excellent post.

[gomessi]

We will miss defoe but it isnt a disaster.

Keane has 11 in 24 since he signed again. When he signed he has played a deeper role so there are no problems in front of goal. Play him further forward and he will continue to score and drop deep and link well with peter and the midfield.

[choda]

I never had you down as a keane fan myself.

It's nothing to do with that, I've explained my reasons, the same as Antil.

My favourite player in this team is Modric and in his first year it was Berbatov. I only talk about Keane because his importance is often underated.

[olly27]

It's nothing to do with that, I've explained my reasons, the same as Antil.

My favourite player in this team is Modric and in his first year it was Berbatov. I only talk about Keane because his importance is often underated.

I have never underated Keane's value to the side mate, so was a bit perplexed as to why your initial post was so defensive regarding Keane. I am huge fan of Keane and Defoe and recognise their different attributes and qualities.

[choda]

Thats very true. I know what your saying, we have enough quality in forward positions for it not to effect us. All I am saying is I would rather have him in the side than not. I still think Keane and Defoe will cause the most problems, although I love Crouchy and the threat he can pose to.

I have a feeling that Keane and Lennon will destroy Stoke next week but I expect us to leak a goal as well.

Oh yea, I agree with that. I'm more concerned when Keane is missing though or especially when Wilson is out because if there isn't anyone else up front that does the all round bringing together of our quality play like Keane there is fecking no one near Wilson at what he does (not for more than a few games anyway and lets face it if he didn't come on yesterday when it got tough we could have easily collapsed).

Weirdly I'm actually less concerned about Modric being out than Wilson or even Keane for the reasons above, not to mind JD.

But yea, I would prefer to have JD in the team and Modric definitely pushes us up a gear but I do feel for Modric to be unreal he needs a framework around him, team ingredients to bring him into the game and in our case it is Wilson for the spine and Keane as the focal point. And JD needs that as well to be lethal.

That's how I see it anyway and if you look at what Harry says and what he does I think he is certainly thinking along those lines as well.

[choda]

I have never underated Keane's value to the side mate, so was a bit perplexed as to why your initial post was so defensive regarding Keane. I am huge fan of Keane and Defoe and recognise their different attributes and qualities.

It wasn't really directed at you mate, just the general sort of commentary around the place.

[olly27]

It wasn't really directed at you mate, just the general sort of commentary.

Oh fair play mate :santaclaus: You know the thing is, this year, every bloody game looks tricky almost. I just hope we consolidate our position by beating Stoke this weekend - but nervous about this game for some reason, even though its at home. I see them doing another Birmingham on us.

[gomessi]

Oh fair play mate :santaclaus: You know the thing is, this year, every bloody game looks tricky almost. I just hope we consolidate our position by beating Stoke this weekend - but nervous about this game for some reason, even though its at home. I see them doing another Birmingham on us.

They'll play 442 so I see no problems.

Comfortable 3-1 win.

[choda]

Oh fair play mate :santaclaus: You know the thing is, this year, every bloody game looks tricky almost. I just hope we consolidate our position by beating Stoke this weekend - but nervous about this game for some reason, even though its at home. I see them doing another Birmingham on us.

Stoke away will be a sticky f*cker this year for everyone, but at home I think we will put them to the sword easily if we play well. If we don't it could be a tight win, but I still think we will beat them.

Funny you say every game is tricky. I don't see it that way at all. I think the league has suddenly become very divided.

Granted the top nine are all taking points off each other, but the other ones are all very winnable even when you don't play near your best. That's what I think anyway.

I'm just glad we appear to have gotten a real resilience and purpose like a top side. I thought it would come when he made some great transfers and put elements in through coaching. Hats off to Harry.

[TURKISH]

It's nothing to do with that, I've explained my reasons, the same as Antil.

My favourite player in this team is Modric and in his first year it was Berbatov. I only talk about Keane because his importance is often underated.

Have people underated him? I think most people would agree you find and use every opportunity to talk up how good Keane is. Are you a double glazing sales man by any chance?

Keane is a great footballer who is almight important to us, but if he continues to play like he did yesterday which he has done on more than one occassion since he returned then he isn't a positive influence on us. But keane is one of the first names on the team sheet no matter who is fit or injured. A top class striker imo just a shame Liverpool took that shine away from him.

Keane needs to get further forward now so he can link up with crouch.

[olly27]

Stoke away will be a sticky f*cker this year for everyone, but at home I think we will put them to the sword easily if we play well. If we don't it could be a tight win, but I still think we will beat them.

Funny you say every game is tricky. I don't see it that way at all. I think the league has suddenly become very divided.

Granted the top nine are all taking points off each other, but the other ones are all very winnable even when you don't play near your best. That's what I think anyway.

I'm just glad we appear to have gotten a real resilience and purpose like a top side. I thought it would come when he made some great transfers and put elements in through coaching. Hats off to Harry.


I think most games are tricky for most in the league. I mean look how well Wigan played today, excellent performance. Wolves nearly beat Everton at Goodison and the week before Pompey beat them at home. I think there is much more of an unpredicatble nature to the league this season, more than there has ever been. Liverpool losing 4 games already when they only lost two all last season. Chelsea getting beat 3-1 by Wigan a few weeks back, Villa beating Pool 3-1 at Anfield, Burnley beating United, Sunderland so close to beating United the week before. United hanging on against Bolton yesterday. Bolton and Wigan are bottam half sides as well. I think there are quite a few teams capable of taking points off the big boys, and that extends beyond the second tier of teams (City, Spurs, Villa, Everton) as even Wigan have proved.

[choda]

Have people underated him? I think most people would agree you find and use every opportunity to talk up how good Keane is. Are you a double glazing sales man by any chance?

Keane is a great footballer who is almight important to us, but if he continues to play like he did yesterday which he has done on more than one occassion since he returned then he isn't a positive influence on us. But keane is one of the first names on the team sheet no matter who is fit or injured. A top class striker imo just a shame Liverpool took that shine away from him.

Keane needs to get further forward now so he can link up with crouch.

I've told you why that is, gave you my reasons. So why be a dick about it? This is a forum, you can say what you like.

Fact is for most people he isn't one of the first names on the teamsheet, in fact half the fans wouldn't even have him in the side, so it is a big talking point and a big debate, hence my point.

[TURKISH]

I've told you why that is, gave you my reasons. So why be a dick about it? This is a forum, you can say what you like.

Fact is for most people he isn't one of the first names on the teamsheet so it is a big talking point and a big debate, hence my point.

For me its like your best mate keep banging on about how fit his bird is, you know she is fit and has been for years but you don't want it rubbed in your face when talking about snooker ect.

[choda]

For me its like your best mate keep banging on about how fit his bird is, you know she is fit and has been for years but you don't want it rubbed in your face when talking about snooker ect.

So you don't think it is relevant on this thread? Of course it is relevant. Most people will be thinking Defoe is the most important striker and it could cost us dear. I'm saying it won't and say why I think that is.

So I think you are out of order and I don't care what people think I have my reasons for talking about Keane and it's perfectly rational, if it's misunderstood then that's not my fault.

Just because someone sees it differently or sees an issue as more important and really wants spurs to do well too doesn't mean they 'have a thing' about one player or never praise others even when they play well. It is about how you see it and you are perfectly entitled to express that.

Two other people said exactly the same thing as me on this thread too but they didn't get comments on it.

[TURKISH]

So you don't think it is relevant on this thread? Of course it is relevant. Most people will be thinking Defoe is the most important striker and it could cost us dear. I'm saying it won't and say why I think that is.

So I think you are out of order and I don't care what people think I have my reasons for talking about Keane and it's perfectly rational, if it's misunderstood then that's not my fault.

Just because someone sees it differently or sees an issue as more important and really wants spurs to do well too doesn't mean they 'have a thing' about one player or never praise others even when they play well. It is about how you see it and you are perfectly entitled to express that.

Two other people said exactly the same thing as me on this thread too but they didn't get comments on it.

You do over do it pal at times LOL.:santaclaus:

[Indianspur]

Forget keane or defoe.. i think Pav is a deadlier finisher than defoe but may lack his running off the ball and sharpness.
However get pavlychenko a sniff on goal and he will score, just remember the carling cup last season. He can score when least expected.

Im also hoping lennon and wilson are rested for carling cup and bale+dos santos brought in, if fit. krancjar can play in the centre too.

[Gino Ginelli]

Defoe is bang in form, so naturally it's a big loss, but this is where having 4 top forwards in the squad helps us out. Apart from the first half of last season, up front has never been an area of real concern for me, as we've always had some good goalscorers. The big games for us, as ever, are won and lost in midfield.

I'm more worried about Palacios getting too many silly yellow cards and ruling himself out, and getting Modric back into the squad.

[Gino Ginelli]

Forget keane or defoe.. i think Pav is a deadlier finisher than defoe but may lack his running off the ball and sharpness.
However get pavlychenko a sniff on goal and he will score, just remember the carling cup last season. He can score when least expected.

Im also hoping lennon and wilson are rested for carling cup and bale+dos santos brought in, if fit. krancjar can play in the centre too.

I'd love to see him get a start, I think he'd have been be so good for us if we hadn't signed Crouchy. But it looks like he's off and Harry can't wait for him to leave.

Such a shame.

[Antilokhos]

Two other people said exactly the same thing as me on this thread too but they didn't get comments on it.

My Spurs controversial love is Jenas, say the word and I'll start gushing about him and everybody will forget Keane. :thumbup1:

[Gino Ginelli]

My Spurs controversial love is Jenas, say the word and I'll start gushing about him and everybody will forget Keane. :thumbup1:

Now there's another subject that's been done to death :001_rolleyes:

[Shelfside]

Defoe is bang in form, so naturally it's a big loss, but this is where having 4 top forwards in the squad helps us out. Apart from the first half of last season, up front has never been an area of real concern for me, as we've always had some good goalscorers. The big games for us, as ever, are won and lost in midfield.

I'm more worried about Palacios getting too many silly yellow cards and ruling himself out, and getting Modric back into the squad.

Having 4 top strikers in your squad is one one thing,but having 4 in-form strikers in your squad is quite another.
Defoe = yes,Crouch = yes,Keane = no,Pav = untried.
Keane is not doing it at the moment and I'm not sure that Pav can be arsed with us anymore.We are capable of getting goals from midfield too and we should have enough in the tank to beat Stoke and Everton but I would much rather be facing Arsenal with Defoe in the team.

[olly27]

Having 4 top strikers in your squad is one one thing,but having 4 in-form strikers in your squad is quite another.
Defoe = yes,Crouch = yes,Keane = no,Pav = untried.
Keane is not doing it at the moment and I'm not sure that Pav can be arsed with us anymore.We are capable of getting goals from midfield too and we should have enough in the tank to beat Stoke and Everton but I would much rather be facing Arsenal with Defoe in the team.

I agree with you regarding Defoe, and is the very point I was trying to make in my initital post. Defoe and Modric in the NLD and I would give us a great chance...obviously with Wilson and Ledley playing.

[Gino Ginelli]

Having 4 top strikers in your squad is one one thing,but having 4 in-form strikers in your squad is quite another.
Defoe = yes,Crouch = yes,Keane = no,Pav = untried.
Keane is not doing it at the moment and I'm not sure that Pav can be arsed with us anymore.We are capable of getting goals from midfield too and we should have enough in the tank to beat Stoke and Everton but I would much rather be facing Arsenal with Defoe in the team.

Err... Robbie's got 5 goals this season in the league, Crouchy has 1.

Granted Robbie only managed those goals against Hull and Burnley, and Crouchy's been on the bench, but I'd say Robbie's got more form at present.

Having said that he's actually quite lucky that Defoe is suspended, as I could see him getting dropped for Crouch next weekend after his non-existent display against Pompey.

Defoe is a massive loss as he's our most natural and instinctive finisher, but I stand by my assertation that we have plenty of quality up front to score the goals.

[gomessi]

So you don't think it is relevant on this thread? Of course it is relevant. Most people will be thinking Defoe is the most important striker and it could cost us dear. I'm saying it won't and say why I think that is.

So I think you are out of order and I don't care what people think I have my reasons for talking about Keane and it's perfectly rational, if it's misunderstood then that's not my fault.

Just because someone sees it differently or sees an issue as more important and really wants spurs to do well too doesn't mean they 'have a thing' about one player or never praise others even when they play well. It is about how you see it and you are perfectly entitled to express that.

Two other people said exactly the same thing as me on this thread too but they didn't get comments on it.

Yeah but I'm not Irish so I can get away with it. :tongue:

Half this board think I have a thing for spanish players but it doesnt bother me one bit. It is only a forum afterall.

[MiloMinderbinder]

Actually think no Defoe for the NLD could work in our favour. The scum do not know how to defend against a physical presence and Crouch is the ultimate in that. That said I'd rather Crouch and Defoe than Crouch and Keane as JD's pace would IMO be more valuable vs Scum than Keane's "cleverness".

Unfortuantely, I have to say that other thna the stroll in the park vs Burnley and some flashes in other games, Keane has actually been pretty poor this season, those in the stands reckon if he wasn't captian he'd have been dropped some time ago.

[gomessi]

Actually think no Defoe for the NLD could work in our favour. The scum do not know how to defend against a physical presence and Crouch is the ultimate in that. That said I'd rather Crouch and Defoe than Crouch and Keane as JD's pace would IMO be more valuable vs Scum than Keane's "cleverness".

Unfortuantely, I have to say that other thna the stroll in the park vs Burnley and some flashes in other games, Keane has actually been pretty poor this season, those in the stands reckon if he wasn't captian he'd have been dropped some time ago.

Or you could say keane has always played and we've picked up 19 from 9 ande 49 from 25 since he joined. If he continues to play like he has been and we averaging2 points per game we cant really moan...

[Gino Ginelli]

And again, you could say that if JD hadn't been injured in January, Keane wouldn't even be here... :001_unsure:

[Ioang]

Haven't read all the comments here but reading a few, with a bit (not too much) of Keano vs. Defoe; how deluded was Martin Jol that they couldn't play together? Absoloutely loved the bloke but he missed a trick there, since when do we ever lump balls up anyway?

[gomessi]

Haven't read all the comments here but reading a few, with a bit (not too much) of Keano vs. Defoe; how deluded was Martin Jol that they couldn't play together? Absoloutely loved the bloke but he missed a trick there, since when do we ever lump balls up anyway?

We played a lot of hoofball under MJ! Away from home we were rubbish with the ball and our main tactic was HOPING the strikers would win the game for us.

MJ never believed in 2 little guys up front and that was because we resorted to a lot of long ball rubbish and that will never work with defoe and keane.

Here is what MJ said


Jol said: " Anybody who scores goals out of the blue, he will play all the time but sometimes you have to make a choice.

"It is like Mourinho with Crespo and Drogba and West Bromwich with their five strikers and West Ham with their five strikers.

"Jermain and Robbie Keane can play well together but sometimes, when there is a long ball from Paul Robinson, it is a bit difficult.:thumbdown:

"I favour someone who is strong and can hold up a ball to give more space for the midfield players.

"And it is not about one player. We have three or four strikers. I have said all along that Jermain is probably the best finisher in England. Hopefully he has improved his game in the time he has not been playing because that is the only thing you can do."

http://www.sundaysun.co.uk/sport/north-east-football/2006/02/06/tottenham-3-charlton-1-79310-16671458/

after beating charlton with defoe and keane

[MiloMinderbinder]

Haven't read all the comments here but reading a few, with a bit (not too much) of Keano vs. Defoe; how deluded was Martin Jol that they couldn't play together? Absoloutely loved the bloke but he missed a trick there, since when do we ever lump balls up anyway?

and that's part of the reason BMJ got the boot, unable to bend his regimented (and shit) tactics to suit players and opposition.

[earl warwick]

I'm not too bothered mate, I have to say.

JD is in great form and he's a finisher, but you see people saying all over the place that we might lack a cutting edge when he is missing.

In case anyone hasn't noticed Keane's long term record for spurs is better (even before Defoe was benched) and his record this year is good too. And his international record is superb, and in recent times he has 6 in 8 games for Ireland. How much more proven do people want?

And he's far more influential in general play and has far less quiet games than Defoe.

It seems people expect Keane to link the play AND score as many as JD and JD only has to score. I don't really understand that.

And Crouchie is a top player, he can come in and score goals and create them.

I don't care who scores the goals and at times with Keane and Crouch it will be others that they've brought into the game. I've zero worries about JD being missing as I think he's replaceable team wise.

I'm not sure we wouldn't miss Keane over a spell of games.

I'd ideally like JD for the Arsenal game but then again they are a small side and Crouch could be a real problem for them.
More Keano arselicking from choda, in a thread called "The Loss of Defoe...":glare: You could almost imagine there's no subject that he could pontificate on that wouldn't include a large paragraph about the incredible qualities of Keane.

[Gino Ginelli]

More Keano arselicking from choda, in a thread called "The Loss of Defoe...":glare: You could almost imagine there's no subject that he could pontificate on that wouldn't include a large paragraph about the incredible qualities of Keane.

Gardening? :001_rolleyes:

[choda]

And again, you could say that if JD hadn't been injured in January, Keane wouldn't even be here... :001_unsure:

And we wouldn't have averaged 2 points a game imo, not near it actually imo.

I don't think he's as out of form as many suggest either. He's not been his best, but that'll come at some point and he's still doing all the little things that a quality player does even when not at his best and it makes a big difference.

[choda]

Yeah but I'm not Irish so I can get away with it. :tongue:

Half this board think I have a thing for spanish players but it doesnt bother me one bit. It is only a forum afterall.

Well, that's the thing, if people disagree with you or think you are overstating it then they think you have an alterior motive, bias, rose tinted glasses or something. It's an opinion for Christ's sake and one that is backed up by great points, facts and reality.

By this logic maybe if Keane was English... he might actually get the appreciation he deserves and I wouldn't have to state his value.

As for the thing for Spanish players, I for one can see it is nothing to do with nationality, it is what makes you want to watch football and what inspires.

Anyone criticising someone for praising and being in awe of Barcelona and Spain at the moment is utterly befuddling to me and even more befuddling if they are a spurs fan (I mean this is why I picked spurs, I thought that was the ethos of every spurs fan). It's not just beautiful, but it's the best and most effective way to play. No one can get near them when they are passing the ball.

I've decided today that I am supporting Spain until Trap is sacked or by some miracle he changes things or some player in the team takes it upon himself to start playing football. It's a great shame because I am deeply patriotic, but if my team doesn't play football then I just support football because I can't take any pride in it.

I really mean it when I say I hated Mourinho's Chelsea and Rafa's Liverpool (not quite as bad these days). I don't want to watch them play. If it's boring it is doing nothing for the sport, so who cares?

You can do the same and more by playing football if you know what you are doing, so why do it? Painful.

[Shelfside]

Err... Robbie's got 5 goals this season in the league, Crouchy has 1.

Granted Robbie only managed those goals against Hull and Burnley, and Crouchy's been on the bench, but I'd say Robbie's got more form at present.


Keane may have scored five league goals compared to one from Crouch but I would still say that even coming off of the bench,Crouch has still played better and contributed more to the team this season than Keane.
Four of Keane's goals were in one match against a Burnley side who are the polar opposite away from home compared to their home form.IMO Keane's confidence has taken a permanent knock after his Liverpool nightmare.

[earl warwick]

Yes, that's a very narrow view from GG, and a summary that doesn't bare any relation to the performances. Again on Saturday Crouch's quality was very much in evidence, in particular when receiving the ball and laying it off, and in his goal threat, not just from corners.

The 2 points per game came from the fulcrum of Palacios/Woody/King in the middle, not from anything that Keane did in particular.

[Gino Ginelli]

And we wouldn't have averaged 2 points a game imo, not near it actually imo.

I don't think he's as out of form as many suggest either. He's not been his best, but that'll come at some point and he's still doing all the little things that a quality player does even when not at his best and it makes a big difference.

Hence my "unsure" wobbly face. Just a bit of food for thought... would we have finished as well as we did last season without him. And it was pure chance that we did re-sign him, due to Defoe's injury.

BTW, I don't think most people on here undervalue Robbie at all, and we all know and appreciate how good he's been for us, and his importance to us now. But he has underperformed against the better opposition ( I don't mean just the Manure game where he was out of position), and he was woeful against Portsmouth. If Defoe hadn't been a spaz, then he would have been dropped for Crouch next weekend.

[TURKISH]

The loss of Defoe was imminent today.

[choda]

The loss of Defoe was imminent today.

It was yea, it was the same against Bolton. Against ugly teams that sit back it is more effective to have very direct players pacey, shooters like Defoe. And Jenas was much more effective for the same reasons, he didn't really turn up for Bolton though.

[TURKISH]

It was yea, it was the same against Bolton. Against ugly teams that sit back it is more effective to have very direct players pacey, shooters like Defoe. And Jenas was much more effective for the same reasons.

But still it shouldn't have been a problem. JJ played better than most of the team even though he played 15min.:thumbdown:

[choda]

But still it shouldn't have been a problem. JJ played better than most of the team even though he played 15min.:thumbdown:

Oh yea, it did suit him though and he's always liable to get his ass in gear when he's been dropped. They could've made the change after 60 minutes though, I thought it was crying out for his forward surges and you could have told him to go forward at every opportunity.

I made a post in the match thread about the other reasons I thought we should have won anyway though.

[gomessi]

We missed defoe today.

[deadleyledley]

we really missed him against stoke. he plays off the last man and therefore he can cause big bulky centre halves problems.

[Gino Ginelli]

We missed Defoe in that his absence compromised our style of approach play.